Sunday, 16 January 2022

Canadian COVID-19 vaccine study seized on by anti-vaxxers — highlighting dangers of early research in pandemic

https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/covid-19-vaccine-study-omicron-anti-vaxxers-1.6315890

 

Canadian COVID-19 vaccine study seized on by anti-vaxxers — highlighting dangers of early research in pandemic

Study found boosters only 37% effective against Omicron, but data being revised


A Canadian study that vastly underestimated the protection COVID-19 vaccines provide against the Omicron variant is being revised — but not before it spread widely on social media by anti-vaxxers, academics and even the creators of the Russian Sputnik V vaccine.

The Ontario preprint study, which has not yet been peer reviewed, suggested that any three doses of mRNA COVID-19 vaccines were just 37 per cent effective against Omicron infection, while two doses actually showed negative protection.

The preprint has been shared on Twitter more than 15,000 times in the two weeks since it's been published, according to Altmetric, a company that tracks where published research is posted online. That's in the top five per cent of all research it's ever tracked.

The group behind Sputnik V shared the results to its one million Twitter followers earlier this month, saying the study showed "negative efficacy" of two mRNA vaccine doses and "quickly waning efficiency" of a booster. The group did not respond to questions from CBC News.

Dr. Vinay Prasad, an associate professor of epidemiology at the University of California-San Francisco, also shared it on Twitter, asking why the U.S Food and Drug Administration (FDA) and Centers for Disease Control (CDC) would advise a booster for Omicron at all.

     A health-care worker administers a COVID-19 vaccine at a mass vaccination clinic at the Toronto Zoo on Wednesday. (Evan Mitsui/CBC)

Study updating findings with totally different results

But the paradoxical findings were later found to have been influenced by behavioural and methodological issues, such as the timing of the observational study, the way in which vaccine passports altered individual risk and changes in access to COVID-19 testing.

The results are currently being updated with additional data that showed completely different results, said Dr. Jeff Kwong, the study's lead author and an epidemiologist and senior scientist at the Institute for Clinical Evaluative Sciences (ICES) in Toronto.

"We're in the process of adding two more weeks of data and it looks like there's no more negative VE (vaccine effectiveness). Our results are now more in line with the data from the U.K. where it's lower, for sure, compared to Delta, but never getting to negative," he told CBC News.

"And then higher VE with the boost. So I think that's good news and we're just in the process of running those analyses and we hope to have an updated version, a version two, by sometime next week." 

A recent report from the Imperial College London COVID-19 response team found that while Omicron largely evades immunity from prior infection and two doses provided just zero to 20 per cent protection, three doses increased that to between 55 and 80 per cent. 

That means the updated preprint could end up showing that protection against Omicron infection is more than twice as high as initially reported. As of Friday, the preprint study remained unchanged on the medRxiv website where it was posted. 

CBC cited the study in an analysis story last week, but has since removed reference to it until the data is updated. 

The study was also highlighted by the federal government's COVID-19 Immunity Task Force earlier this week, before the discrepancies in the data were discovered.

"We've touched base with Dr. Kwong and indeed he informed us of new data as of Monday night," a spokesperson said in response to CBC News raising concerns about the study's accuracy. 

"As the data from this week does change things, we've pulled the preprint from our magazine that's being sent out today." 

Dr. Danuta Skowronski, with the B.C. Centre for Disease Control, says the rapid sharing of COVID-19 vaccine studies on social media has completely changed the research landscape, adding more pressure to get early results right. (CBC)

Dr. Danuta Skowronski, a vaccine effectiveness expert and epidemiology lead at the B.C. Centre for Disease Control, who developed the vaccine study design used in the preprint, posted a commentary urging "extreme caution" with the results last week.

"If you have a negative estimate, you want to start looking at, OK, well, which subgroup is driving that and why?'" she told CBC News.

"Is it the asymptomatic? Is it the symptomatic? Is it people who were screened for work? Is it people who had a rapid antigen test? Which group is it that's driving that paradoxical finding?" 

Skowronski said until those questions have been resolved, "all bets are off" on the interpretation of the results and "the validity of the study has to be questioned." 

"In the real world, we cannot control the behaviour of people, and so these studies are susceptible to lack of comparability between the vaccinated and the unvaccinated," she said, adding that vaccine passports dramatically changed the risk of exposure in Ontario. 

"There are good reasons to believe that the very slim fraction of people who remain unvaccinated — that group are quite different now from vaccinated individuals." 

Study spread like wildfire with anti-vaxxers online

The study highlights the speed in which early study results that have not undergone peer review can spread online in the pandemic and the way in which inaccurate findings can be weaponized to fit an agenda before they can be corrected. 

Many who shared the study on Twitter used anti-vaccination rhetoric to allege boosters didn't work against COVID-19, while others posited the vaccines should not have been approved for emergency use by the FDA in the first place because they did not meet its initial 50 per cent efficacy threshold.

"This will definitely be used by bad actors to consolidate support for their views about the lack of COVID-19 vaccination effectiveness," said Ahmed Al-Rawi, an assistant professor at Simon Fraser University's School of Communication who specializes in disinformation.

"I would immediately take it down and make some public statements about the inaccurate findings of the study, because this has been shared widely on social media and it will only confuse people more." 

WATCH | Ontario ICU overwhelmed by mostly unvaccinated patients:

The mostly unvaccinated patients overwhelming an Ontario ICU

3 days ago
Duration 3:39
Mostly unvaccinated patients are overwhelming the ICU at a Sarnia, Ont., hospital and some will head home with a new perspective on COVID-19, the vaccine and life. 3:39

The study also notably did not look at the protection vaccines offered from severe COVID-19, which has been shown to be much higher than against Omicron infection alone — something Kwong says he and his colleagues will be adding in a future version.

While COVID-19 vaccines don't provide total protection from infection, they do work well at preventing serious disease. New data from the Public Health Agency of Canada found Canadians with two doses were 19 times less likely to be hospitalized than those unvaccinated.

"Several studies have shown modest protection from two doses against Omicron infection, but better protection against severe outcomes such as hospitalization," said Marc Lipsitch, an epidemiologist at the Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health in Boston.

"This benefit is over and above any possible benefit of preventing infection or transmission."

Lipsitch said Skowronski's criticisms of the study are valid. He has cautioned against comparing positive cases among those with symptoms with those not tested for different reasons, adding he very much agrees this approach can be a source of "substantial bias."

"When investigators try to share early results in the interests of public health, as these folks did, there's often a lot of uncertainty in those estimates," said Dr. David Fisman, an epidemiologist at the University of Toronto's Dalla Lana School of Public Health.

"But it's very hard to reel in once people start using early versions of your work in support of misinformation."

Skowronski said the rapid sharing of COVID-19 vaccine studies on social media has completely changed the research landscape, adding more pressure to get early results right.

"You need to ask yourself, why do we need to post it now? Why can it not wait the one or two weeks? How will this impact public and policy decision-making?" Skowronski said.

"And if you can't answer that, then we really should be asking ourselves: Why are we rushing to preprint?"

WATCH | Canadians urged by health experts to take first available vaccine:

Health experts urge Canadians to take whichever vaccine is available

9 days ago
Duration 2:13
Health experts across the country are urging Canadians to stop shopping around for their preferred brand and take whichever COVID-19 vaccine is available. 2:13

Skowronski released a study in 2010 showing paradoxical negative vaccine effectiveness during the 2009 H1N1 pandemic that found those who had a flu shot were more likely to get infected with the influenza strain than people who hadn't, which was later proven right.

But she first assumed the findings were methodologically inaccurate, reached out to outside experts around the world, conducted multiple different studies and worked with an international panel of experts.

"I learned the lesson the hard way back in 2009 in dealing with paradoxical findings and the level of rigour required," she said. "You don't approach this in a casual way — it does require lots of thinking, lots of worry — before you can arrive at this."

Dr. Ivan Oransky, co-founder of Retraction Watch, a website that tracks errors in science journals, said because the study turned out to be "flawed," the researchers should move fast to update their findings.

"They're doing the right thing. The question is how quickly will they do it?" he said. "I mean, they're talking about next week … but that is a bit of an eternity in this day and age."

ABOUT THE AUTHOR

Adam Miller

Senior Writer

Adam Miller is a senior health writer with CBC News. He's covered health, politics and breaking news extensively in Canada for over a decade, in addition to several years reporting on news and current affairs throughout Asia.

 

 

10869 Comments
Commenting is now closed for this story.
 
 
 
 
David Amos
Methinks its interesting that nobody has been allowed to mention Operation Bear Hug 2.0 N'esy Pas?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Robert Harding
Sign seen at recent antivaxxer rally: "I drink yurin!"
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Robert Harding : Like yourself much?
 
 
David Blake
Reply to @David Amos: I think you can discern the capacity of Robert to engage constructively.
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @David Blake: Only a fool would argue a fool
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Robert Harding
Antivaxxers are so enthusiastic about the new YST (Yellow Snow Therapy) that some worry they'll run out of their latest therapeutic miracle. "I done my own research," says antivax genius Cletus Billy-Joe Bob. "I don't worry about running out cuz I done make my own. YST is yummy!"
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Robert Harding : However sincere people are blocked
 
 
Robert Harding
Reply to @David Amos: I know some sincere flat-earthers. Sincerity adds no value to their "opinions."
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Robert Harding : Who is playing the straw man game? In my humble opinion in order for you opinion to count at all you should use your real name
 
 
Robert Harding
Reply to @David Amos: What's your point?
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Robert Harding : Go Figure
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Robert Harding
Sign seen at a recent antivaxxer rally: "The scietist dont no what there talking about I done my own reserch!"
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Robert Harding : BS
 
 
Robert Harding
Reply to @David Amos: For real. This sign was among the more literate.
 
 
 
 
 
 
Brian Bacon
How far we have come from 2 shots and we can get back to normal. Does anyone else find it ironic that we are now arguing that 2 shots do not have negative efficacy and boosted efficacy is not 37%. Both are somewhat higher, maybe.
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Brian Bacon: Furthermore what is with constant flip flop on the mask nonsense???
 
 
Brian Bacon
Reply to @David Amos: masks are pure virtue signaling, nothing more. BC citizens have been masking for months on orders from CMO Bonnie Henry. However if you go to the journal of the BC nurses association December 2016 you can read quotes from Dr. Henry in an article about an arbitration regarding mask mandates in hospitals where she acknowledges that there is very little scientific evidence that supports their use. She knows it’s theater yet here we are. 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
David Blake
So a person recovered from COVID, protected at least as well as double vaxed, with a bmi of 20 and blood pressure of 120/80 with a healthy blood glucose level who is clearly at an almost negligible level of clogging up even the most inadequate of ICU capacity, should be coerced into an injection to satisfy someone’s ideology? Where is the logic for that? One size fits all mandates are illogical.
 
 
Colin Calnan
Reply to @David Blake:
Having recovered from COVID does not make you as resistant to re-infection as being fully vaccinated. If that were the case no one would catch it more than once.
 
 
David Blake
Reply to @Colin Calnan: study after study suggests otherwise
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @David Blake: Methinks many folks would dearly love to see all these "experts" argue Dr. Lee Merritt N'esy Pas?
 
 
Brian Bacon
Reply to @Colin Calnan: Many people thought they had it twice but the PCR test can return a positive result months after infection.
 
 
David Blake
Reply to @David Amos: it would seem most are not willing to consider anything but what they are fed. And they’re being fed a single course unbalanced diet.
 
 
David Blake
Reply to @Brian Bacon: all bets off for omicron…no matter vax status or natural. Both get some protection from severe outcomes…
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @David Blake: I concur I see no harm in debating anything in a purportedly
"Just Democracy"
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @David Amos: Check out any Fundy Royal Debate you can find 
   
 
Robert Harding
Reply to @David Blake: Cool strawman, bro.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated 
Has anyone kept a tally of how many opinions about this opinion went "Poof" over the last few days???  
 
 
 
 
 
David Lopez
Content deactivated  
I’m hearing there has been a ruling in the international courts regarding the wrong doing of government officials, top doctors and corporate heads. According to the ruling we, as individuals, have the authority to seize the assets of those 75 people named in the indictment. I’ll let you all fact check this information and find out who appears on that list. Check it out though it’s quite fascinating indeed.

Can someone confirm this to be true?
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated  
Reply to @David Lopez: Dream on
 
 
 
 

Maria Tomas
Quebec Premier wants to tax un-vaccinated because he says 90% of the Quebec people sacrificed getting the vaccine and are owed some kind of measures. When is taking something that is supposed to be safe and effective a sacrifice? I have never have felt that I was owed any measures when I have taken a safe and effective aspirin. Maybe I haven't been demanding enough. Double messaging going on here. Not making any sense.
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Maria Tomas: Has any of this nonsense made any sense???
 
 
Robert Harding
Reply to @David Amos: Interrogative tautology. Very nice! 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Joseph Halifax
day 4for this thread tomorrow.

Keep the rhetoric going and flowing. Jt loves it
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Joseph Halifax: Me Too
 
 
Joseph Halifax
Reply to @David Amos: Yeah thats pretty obvious 
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated
Reply to @Joseph Halifax: My tally says you only see about 1/4 of what is obvious to you 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated   
Methinks its wise to not believe anything until its officially denied N'esy Pas?
 
 
David Armstrong
Content deactivated 
Reply to @David Amos: What.
 
 
David Amos 
Content deactivated 
Reply to @David Armstrong: Think about it
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
giorgio maniatoianni
Is this article a public opinion poll on what people really think of vaccines? I can't find any other explanation why this article on data revision or manipulation (depending which "side" you are on) is a top story for three days now. Apart from that, poor journalism that offers no useful information whatsoever.
 
 
Tanner Moorman
Reply to @giorgio maniatoianni: It says a lot about a person when they need to invent a massive conspiracy to support their opinions.
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @giorgio maniatoianni: I concur
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Tanner Moorman: Perhaps you should check my work
 
 
John Evert
Reply to @David Amos: Tanner has gone home for the evening and will reply in 9am sharp tomorrow morning.
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated 
Reply to @John Evert: Perhaps he had a stroke and they will call it COVID morbidity 
 
 
John Evert
Reply to @David Amos: Easy to find out...just type "suddenly and unexpectedly" + name. :-)
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated 
Reply to @John Evert: Do you really think that is his real name?
 
 
John Evert
Reply to @David Amos: I have noticed a trend that the most on-point commenters (for the division of Canada) seem to be the most prolific too. So much so that is really appears to me that it is a full time job. I don't know if that is his real name but I would doubt it.
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated
Reply to @John Evert: I am easy to check out
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Steven Mac
What company spends the most on lobbying?
A 2020 study found that, from 1999 to 2018, the pharmaceutical industry and health product industry together spent $4.7 billion lobbying the United States federal government, an average of $233 million per year.
 
 
Art McCarthy
Reply to @Steven Mac:
I'm guessing one of the O&G companies.
 
 
Tanner Moorman
Reply to @Steven Mac: News flash genius. This is Canada, not America. We have laws and regulations in this county for drug manufacturers. Educate yourself. Btw, oil and gas companies spend the most amount of money every year lobbying our government.
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated  
Reply to @Steven Mac: I studied Big Pharma lobbying in 2003 after George Couto, Bayer Corp, U.S. Attorney Michael Sullivan and I were in US District Court in Beantown at the same time and before the same Judge who is also Robert Mueller's old buddy while Whitey Bulger was still on the run and I was dogging him for fun and the big bounty. (The Bayer matter was called lick and stick)
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated  
Reply to @Tanner Moorman: FYI Bayer Corp is in Canada ask the victims of tainted blood or the farmers who buy Monsanto products
 
 
John Evert   
Reply to @Tanner Moorman: Thanks for the insight Tanner...guessing you will reply at 9am tomorrow morning. 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Dean Lenglet
Why would anyone listen to an anti vaxxer.
 
 
 
 
Ira Thompson
Reply to @Tanner Moorman:
That's all you have ? So are conceding that I am right about this being the first and fastest mRNA ever allowed to market and the data used to approve them came directly from the manufacturer ? How can the long term effects of these jabs be known if they were studied for only a few months ?
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated
Reply to @Tanner Moorman: "That’s a really funny parody of an unhinged partisan conspiracy theorist. Good one!"

Anyone can check my work proving that Ira Thompson is correct
 
 
Robert Harding
Reply to @Dean Lenglet: For clinical insights. 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
David Amos 
Content deactivated 
Methinks its wise to not believe anything until its officially denied N'esy Pas?
 
 
Simon McVeigh 
Content deactivated 
Reply to @David Amos: by then, it’s too late… may as well let the powers that be know that vaccine apartheid is unacceptable!
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated 
Reply to @Simon McVeigh: I did that out of the gate
 
 
 
 
 
 
Michael -Smith
Content deactivated 
Persuasion,bribery, exclusion have been exhausted. What kind of punishment will they now bring for refusing medical advice
 
 
Mike Stephenson
Content deactivated 
Reply to @Michael -Smith: What did you have in mind?
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated 
Reply to @Michael -Smith: The Gulag Perhaps 
 
 
Michael -Smith
Content deactivated 
Reply to @David Amos: after denying them food based on safety, this seems likely at some point 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Marcus Veritas 
Content deactivated 
What do vaxxers and anti-vaxxers have in common?
Neither will ever be fully vaccinated.
 
 
 
Michael Murphy
Content deactivated 
Reply to @Marcus Veritas: well we both don't go posting Facebook memes on CBC, so that separates us
 
 
Peejay Gazebo
Content deactivated
Reply to @Marcus Veritas: what separates them ? The vaxxers won't end up often as dead or in hospital and aren' spending all their free time obsessed about vaccines, they have spent an hour here and there getting a few shots and most haven't give it a second though other than having to suffer debates with their anti vaccine friends, and missing out on threatens and stuff. It really was't a bit deal for most of us to go get a shot. I spend less time on it than what socks to buy this month. I'm not worried about the health effects either. I use to go raves and swim in sewage.
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated
Reply to @Marcus Veritas: LMAO
   


 
 
 
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated 
Methinks its wise to nor believe anything until its officially denied N'esy Pas?
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated 
Reply to @David Amos: not 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Steven Mac 
Can someone explain this title to me? The Pf CEO said they will work on an omicron version, but it will take 4 more month.. so what is this booster doing? I'm so confused about this vaccine... I mean.. If i had 3 smallpox shots in 10 months and then I still got smallpox.. or needed another shot (4 in a year).. i'd have some questions... Anyone else?
 
 
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Steven Mac: Ask Trudeau the Younger He works hard for us and knows everything
 
 
Emilio D'Angelo 
Reply to @markus Canter: You mean trilliionaires....
 
 
Henry Oliver
Reply to @Steven Mac: agreed. I don't know anyone who was vaccinated for the measles or Polio and then came down with a mild case of either. Vaccines induce immunity to prevent transmission and disease - this "vaccine" does neither.  
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Henry Oliver: I agree  
 
 
Jeffrey Lebowski 
Reply to @Henry Oliver: Well if you want to quibble with the name so be it. So what do you call a drug that significantly reduces deaths, hospitalizations, and transmissions?
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Jeffrey Lebowski: Does it???
 
 
Jeffrey Lebowski
Reply to @David Amos: Yes. If you accept what the experts and data say. If not, then you have much to prove. 
 
 
David Vane
Reply to @Bob Rialy: It's really kind of strange isn't it ? So many out there that seem to want to keep this going , a strange phenomenon for sure.
 
 
Robert Jones 
Reply to @Victoria Thomas: "the booster should only be given to immune-compromised and older people in hospitals with other health conditions, and those who feel they might benefit from the 3 month, 30% extra protection. Should not be forced on everyone including healthy young people "

My thoughts as well.
 
 
Robert Jones  
Reply to @Craig McMaster: "Smallpox is a very different virus than Covid-19. "

That much is true, yes.

"Saying they're the same is like telling me that a whale and a mosquito are the exact same species... "

Exactly what we have been saying all along: smallpox can be a deadly disease even to the healthy, while COVID is more of a nuisance. Glad you are finally coming around and seeing the reality of the situation.
 
 
Robert Jones 
Reply to @Bart B. Van Bockstaele: "We are not there yet. Hospitals are being overwhelmed."

Not by COVID-19, and not by the unvaccinated, either.
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated 
Reply to @Jeffrey Lebowski: Nope The onus is upon you to show the Data ad prove it
However it seems that you only throw a gutter balls tonight
 
 
Craig McMaster
Reply to @David Dodge:
Based on the statistics, if you want to avoid hospitalization and/or death from Covid-19: GET VACCINATED.
 
 
Craig McMaster
Reply to @Robert Jones:
We get a new flu vaccine every year for the new strain.

Is that a huge conspiracy??

Or is it that the biology of flu and Covid viruses is different than smallpox???

Oh - but now - because of this new conspiracy world of fear and paranoia, that answer is no longer good enough.

When the conspiracy theorists find an answer that suits them, I'm sure they'll let me know and I'll cringe at how ridiculous it is...

In the meantime, I'll listen to the experts and read the facts.
 
 
markus Canter 
Reply to @Emilio D'Angelo: last time i checked the turkish/newgerman coulpe had made 6.4 Billion.
 
 
markus Canter  
Reply to @markus Canter: couple
 
 
markus Canter  
Reply to @Emilio D'Angelo: they invented it/created it but had no infrastructure to test it, that's where pfizer came in. they had the means and the skills to hide bad results.
 
 
Bart B. Van Bockstaele 
Reply to @Douglas Blake: I do. The data seems to show that the 3rd dose bumps up waned protection to a very respectable 75% or so. The only issue I have with it is that the available doses would do more good when given to people who have not had a single dose, as is the case in many developing countries. But then, that is a political decision, not a personal one.
 
 
Len Evans 
Reply to @Steven Mac: What a persons expectations are regarding what "works" is part of the problem. If you expect no chance of the virous following vaccines, its a high expectation. (35% effective) If you expect a far better chance of avoiding seriois ilkness and hospitalization, the vaccines are much better. Canada has a vaccination rate of about 80%. Hospitals are reporting much higher numbers of the unvaccinated needing hospitalization or help. That points to the facts of how the vaccines work. The minority of unvaccinated people are the majority of sick in hospital. Simple reality. The vaccines work. 
 
 
Amy Nom
Reply to @Steven Mac: You are not supposed to have questions about the efficacy of the vaccines because you will then be labeled an anti-vaxxer. The government doesn't want any info that will lead to vaccine (more like injection) hesitancy.
 
 
Billy Elliott
Reply to @Craig McMaster: If you want to avoid hospitalization and/or death from Covid-19, GET VACCINATED.
Im sorry but stats Canada data demonstrates there is a correlation to age and comorbidities, so why are you opposed to a risked based approach?

Just to highlight the stats:

Average age of death >75
Average age of hope >60

You interpret this differently?
 
 
Billy Elliott
Reply to @Billy Elliott: Average age of death >75
Average age of hospitalization >60
  
 
David Amos
Content deactivated 
@Jeffrey Lebowski posted: "Well if you want to quibble with the name so be it."

I answered his challenge about Data and se that I was blocked??? So lets quibble about who is using their true name as per the rules of the Crown's domain and who is not
 
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Billy Elliott: Amen
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Janice Hutton
What happened to the good old days where the news was reported without the opinion of the reporter having to be injected into the article? 
 
 
 
 
Guy Stone
Reply to @Janice Hutton: it's propaganda, political science, science fiction, and money now... Not science and facts.... The sad part is science and facts are treated like conspiracy theories now
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated 
Reply to @Janice Hutton: When were those good old days???
 
 
Jeffrey Lebowski
Reply to @Guy Stone: says the guy who never accepts scientific consensus. Do you accept anthropogenic global warming? Do you accept vaccines have prevented many deaths and reduced hospitalizations while having very few averse reactions? If not, you don't believe in science and facts.  
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Jeffrey Lebowski: I doubt that the real Jeffrey "The Dude" Lebowski,would either 
 
 
Craig McMaster
Reply to @Janice Hutton:
This article is clearly marked as an OPINION piece...
 
 
Guy Stone
Reply to @Jeffrey Lebowski: yes, I believe in both... But if you think it's yes or no... Then you don't believe in science. 
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Craig McMaster: and so are the comments
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Guy Stone: Amen 
 
 
Tanner Moorman
Reply to @Janice Hutton: Pro tip, if you don’t want to read an opinion article, don’t click on one. There are lots of articles here that don’t have ‘opinion’ in there head line. You just can’t fix Stu pid no matter what you put in the headline here. 
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated
Reply to @Tanner Moorman: Define Stu pid 

 

 
 
 
 
 
 
Rob Johnston
At the end of this, who will write the history of this 'pandemic'? If it's the CBC, we will know that truth was lost.
 
 
 
 
Robert Jones
Reply to @Bobby Stevens: "Not sure how old you are Vid, but the I remember when the CBC used to reputable. Back in the 70's and 80's, even the 90's, they were mostly non-partisan and objective. "

Same here.

I MISS THOSE DAYS.
 
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Rob Johnston: True but the history of this 'pandemic' is being written constantly by legions worldwide In fact you just made some byway of CBC
 
 
Jeffrey Lebowski
Reply to @Rob Johnston: so please tell me what credible news source do you draw upon? I know it is not your own personal investigative reporting. You speak as if you have a higher knowledge, but I suspect you don't.
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated 
Reply to @Jeffrey Lebowski: Have you ever seen CBC or any other "credible news source" report about my doings??? 
 
 
Craig McMaster
Reply to @Bobby Stevens:
Lloyd Robertson was on CTV with Mike Duffy and Pamela Wallin...

BTW - how did the CBC become more Liberal after the Harper Conservatives spent millions making it more conservative?
 
 
Robert Jones
Reply to @Vid Ingelevics: "The funniest contradiction is that guys like Rob spend hours of time here posting - more than 4000 now - and then complain about the CBC as they add to its content. "

We complain about it because our tax dollars are being used to push Liberal narratives here whether we like it or not (and we don't). There is nothing funny about it, sorry.

 
Arthur Plumb
Reply to @Robert Jones: Utter nonsense
 
 
Daryl McMurphy
Reply to @Rob Johnston:
Come on Q, haven't you anything new? Same old skepticism wrapped in conundrum over and over. Just head over to FOX news North at the Post.
 
 
Tanner Moorman 
Reply to @Rob Johnston: It says a lot about a person when they need to invent a massive conspiracy to support their opinions.
 
 
Tanner Moorman 
Reply to @Bobby Stevens: News flash Bobby. CBC didn’t become biased and partisan, you did. It’s not their fault you can no longer accept truths that conflict with your opinions.
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated
Reply to @Jeffrey Lebowski: I see that the editors of our "credible news source" have been busy on your behalf
 
 
Tanner Moorman
Content deactivated
Reply to @Tanner Moorman: Dream on 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Bill Bauer
Questioning the real efficacy of these vaccines does not make one an “anti-vaxxer” as the divisive headlines always suggest. Perhaps it is about the billions of dollars at stake and an attempt at damage control.
 
 
 
 
Peejay Gazebo 
Reply to @Bill Bauer: I have never heard of anyone getting grief for questioning vaccines, only for spreading misinformation and taking about Bill Gates, Q and stuff like that.
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Bill Bauer: I Wholeheartedly Agree Sir
 
 
Donny Dooley
Reply to @robert hayma: Interesting.
 
 
Donny Dooley
Reply to @Bobby Stevens: True.
 
 
Robert Jones 
Reply to @Michael Murphy: "sharing widely the 1 study you want to believe and not believing any of the others makes you an anti vaxxer "

No it doesn't. Being against vaccines (ALL vaccines) is the only thing that can possibly make one a true "anti-vaxxer". Any other definition is just unsupportable.
 
 
Tanner Moorman
Reply to @Jamie Burnhams: ‘Or you know, you won't look as bright as you might be...?’
Oh, the irony.
 
 
Tanner Moorman
Reply to @Dan San: ‘does questioning the safety and efficacy of the vaccine make one an anti vaxxer?’
No, but refusing to accept the fact based data about it certainly does. Latching on to one factually incorrect study while ignoring all others certainly does. Are you starting to understand how wilful ignorance works yet?
 
 
Tanner Moorman
Reply to @Bobby Stevens: What erroneous climate data studies are you referring to Bobby? Looks like more feelings over facts from the wilfully ignorant to me.
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated
Reply to @Tanner Moorman: Define ignorant
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated
Reply to @Donny Dooley: Oh My My look who is emulating me 
 
 
Billy Elliott
Reply to @Tanner Moorman: why does it have to be a study? Cannot be as simple as this is a Coronavirus, Canada will not stop a global pandemic, the average age of hospitalization is >60 and average age of death is >75. Mean while CDC states 75 percent of admittance had 4 or more comorbidities, could this be a reason for a healthy person to not want a flu shot, a covid shot? Or do we all have the same statistics of hospitalization because stats Canada states otherwise.
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Billy Elliott: Methinks we are flogging a dead hose N'esy Pas?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
John Geezy 
You are being conditioned to view your freedom as selfish. 
 
 
 
 
Robert Jones
Reply to @Michael Murphy: " I meant you don't actually get personal freedom in the USA "

Compared to Canada? Don't make me laugh...
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @John Geezy: Bingo
 
 
Donny Dooley
Reply to @David Amos: Still playing your little game on the top posts.
 
 
Daryl McMurphy
Reply to @John Geezy:
You're being conditioned to believe that whining works.
 
 
Tanner Moorman
Reply to @John Geezy: Some people certainly insist on being free to be dum. That’s for sure.
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated
Reply to @Donny Dooley: I am not playing games but I have no doubt you are
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated
Reply to @Tanner Moorman: Trust that I would rather be dumb than clever yet deliberately ignorant
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Jamie Burnhams
This is your taxes at work. No control group, no science (this is junk science or pseudoscience), but we must believe or we get called names. To think we pay for the privilege. 
 
 
Alex Ferentzy
Reply to @Jamie Burnhams: So if you want to pretend to be knowledgably criticizing the science, you might want to check the actual study. It takes time, all of 2 minutes. In this case there were controls "We included 3,442 Omicron-positive cases, 9,201 Delta-positive cases, and 471,545 test-negative controls."  
 
Hector Von Von Kobra
Reply to @Jamie Burnhams: Funding of this broadcaster should not be mandatory for every taxpayer.
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Hector Von Von Kobra: I concur
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Jamie Burnhams: Welcome to the circus 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Rob Johnston 
It appears a great many Canadians don't understand the basics of propaG and how it is used by the 'national broadcaster' to influence their opinion. The 'national broadcaster' has been at it for decades and have really gone hard core over the last few years. And still people cannot see it.....many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system, that they will fight to protect it. Morpheus: As long as the CBC exists, the human race will never be free
 
 
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Jimmy Chan: Me too
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Robert Jones: What do have to say to an anti masker who enjoys litigating against governments?
 
 
 
 
 
 
Steven Mac
I am a Canadian unvaxxed 57-year-old father. I am treated as a second-class citizen as a result. This is making me more determined to stick to my guns as it highlights the bigotry in all of this. Any thinking person at this point can see that this is not about health. It's about power and surveillance.
 
 
 
 
Jonathan Klein
Reply to @Steven Mac:
Good to know there are still free-thinking people in this country, which seems to have been taken over by mindless automatons that simply parrot government talking points.
Questioning the safety of vaccines that are only a year old and use technology never before used in humans is common sense. And there are common-sense ways you can reduce the chances that you will get the virus and your risk of serious disease should you get it besides vaccination. For example, social distancing, reducing your contacts with others, wearing a medical grade mask in indoor public spaces, and practicing good nutrition and fitness.
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Steven Mac: Trust that there lots of folks sticking to our guns
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Chantal LeBouthi 
Right now I really don’t care about this

Im more worried about Canada supply chains security disruption becoming a major security threats To Canadians
 
 
 
 
Daryl McMurphy
Reply to @Phil Trecc:
The argument of the ill informed is to blame government for something not theirs.
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Chantal LeBouthi: Operation Bear Hug 2.0 may help in that regard
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Nicky Barnes
Here's the thing. Everyone in my circle has been fully vaxxed. And many of them and their families fell ill with covid symptoms the past few weeks. And they're better now. Life goes on. Don't need a study to observe what's going on.
 
 
james Nasium
Reply to @Nicky Barnes:
If they hadn't been vaccinated, they might not be better now. It appears the Vaccine(s) did what they were supposed to do
 
 
Edward Kelly
Reply to @james Nasium:
Ah, the Boilerplate answer.
 
 
David Smith
Reply to @james Nasium: Not true South African study released concluded omicron was also mild for the unvaxxed. Look it up
 
 
james Nasium 
Reply to @David Smith:
The OP didn't say what variant his circle had, and there have been severe and fatal outcomes from Omicron
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Edward Kelly: Methinks its wise to not believe anything until its officially denied N'esy Pas?
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Ivan Newton
I’m betting there’s back room pressure to change the way results are viewed
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Ivan Newton: Me too
 
 
 
 
 
 
David Fletcher
This is the issue with people quoting single studies that have not gone through peer review. Media is culpable as well as they frequently do the same thing. The media will have to become more responsible in how they deal with issues of science
 
 
RichardA Sharp
Reply to @David Fletcher:
Fat chance of that. If it bleeds it leads, before, now and forever. Freedom of the press is a disgraced value of ours.
 
 
DD Thomas
Reply to @David Fletcher: I'm almost at the point where I believe the media should not report any single study that hasn't been replicated. Or at the very least they need much more prominent disclaimers than what I've seen so far.
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated 
Reply to @RichardA Sharp: You seem bitter lately
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated 
Reply to @David Amos: Oh My My
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
RichardA Sharp
Any unproven (not peer-reviewed) studies that makes headlines like this should be strickened from the record, shamed into oblivion. Why does CBC give it ANY limelight?
 
 
Tammy Elesko
Reply to @RichardA Sharp: At the same time, the MSM seems to ignore all the peer reviewed studies that show the virus barely effects children.
 
 
Boyd Payne
Reply to @RichardA Sharp: Sure Richard, if it doesn't fit the narrative, shame them into silence. Sunny ways!
 
 
David Amos
Content deactivated 
Reply to @RichardA Sharp: You're Back Me Too
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Tammy Elesko: Yup
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Boyd Payne: Ditto
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Edward Kelly
"but data being revised"
Imagine my surprise.
 
 
Tammy Elesko
Reply to @Edward Kelly: Not fitting the narrative.
 
 
Garry Horsnell
Reply to @Edward Kelly: "Fully vaccinated people are still far less likely to be hospitalized with the virus (COVID-19). According to the Ontario Science Table’s online dashboard, on Tuesday there were 762 hospitalizations per one million people among the unvaccinated, compared to 171 hospitalizations per one million people among those with at least two vaccine doses".
At Toronto General, which cares for the sickest COVID-19 patients, 70 per cent in the intensive care unit are not vaccinated."
Source: CTV News, January 12, 2022

It seems getting vaccinated against COVID-19 reduces the severity of COVID-19 and studies show the vaccinated people with COVID-19 spread virus less than the unvaccinated people with COVID 19.

And booster shots will enhance immunity.

So why wouldn't people get vaccinated against COVID-19?
 
 
Paul Robinson
Reply to @Garry Horsnell: Early Outpatient Treatments are now being openly discussed in the National Post and on CTV. Things now "approved" for off label use that would have gotten a doctor disciplined or fired for prescribing even a few months ago.
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Edward Kelly: I can't imagine it
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Barney Jinder
Better than stupid.
 
 
David Amos
Reply to @Barney Jinder: How so???

 

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