Friday 17 June 2022

Rapid development raises concerns about fate of Fredericton's heritage buildings

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Date: Fri, 17 Jun 2022 18:19:20 +0000
Subject: Automatic reply: RE Rapid development raises concerns about
fate of Fredericton's heritage buildings and a little Deja Vu about
the Risteen Building
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---------- Original message ----------
From: David Amos <david.raymond.amos333@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 17 Jun 2022 15:16:59 -0300
Subject: RE Rapid development raises concerns about fate of
Fredericton's heritage buildings and a little Deja Vu about the
Risteen Building
To: mayor@fredericton.ca, Margo.Sheppard@fredericton.ca,
marcus.kingston@gnb.ca, blaine.higgs@gnb.ca, oldmaison@yahoo.com,
andre@jafaust.com, jbosnitch@gmail.com, David.Coon@gnb.ca,
kris.austin@gnb.ca, robert.gauvin@gnb.ca, premier@gnb.ca,
Jenica.Atwin@parl.gc.ca, bruce@downtownfredericton.ca,
dfi@downtownfredericton.ca, markandcaroline@gmail.com,
aidan.cox@cbc.ca, "sylvie.gadoury" <sylvie.gadoury@radio-canada.ca>,
martin.gaudet@fredericton.ca, info@bellaproperties.ca, "Mark.Blakely"
<Mark.Blakely@rcmp-grc.gc.ca>, Jacques.Poitras@cbc.ca,
steve.murphy@ctv.ca, Newsroom <Newsroom@globeandmail.com>,
3rdage@stu.ca, jeremy.mouat@ualberta.ca, antheaplummer@gmail.com
Cc: motomaniac333 <motomaniac333@gmail.com>, briangallant10
<briangallant10@gmail.com>, "Mike.Comeau" <Mike.Comeau@gnb.ca>,
"Marco.Mendicino" <Marco.Mendicino@parl.gc.ca>, "Brenda.Lucki"
<Brenda.Lucki@rcmp-grc.gc.ca>, "Bill.Hogan" <Bill.Hogan@gnb.ca>

https://davidraymondamos3.blogspot.com/2022/06/rapid-development-raises-concerns-about.html

Friday, 17 June 2022

Rapid development raises concerns about fate of Fredericton's heritage buildings

 

 
 
 
There are many pressing things in this world right now, but would you believe this can be found at one of the busiest intersections in Fredericton? In a gazebo showcasing the history of this neighbourhood no less.
 
Image
 
 
 
Replying to @Aidan4jrn
YO @melaniejoly @premierbhiggs & @RobertGauvin5 Whereas @CBCNews continues to block me and everything in heaven and hell is done in 3 I will remain true to form and make a few calls send some emails then blog about the awful truth of it all #cdnpoli
 
 

 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/fredericton-heritage-development-tension-1.6489278

 

Rapid development raises concerns about fate of Fredericton's heritage buildings

Fredericton Heritage Trust says about 2,000 historically significant buildings have no heritage protection

Staff at city hall are set to embark on a two-year project to plot a path for how the downtown gets developed, known as the south core plan.

That work comes as city council adopted its affordable housing strategy, which lays out recommendations, including allowing developers to create four to six-unit buildings in the urban core without special approvals.

But before any of those plans get implemented, the city needs to do a broad review of how it preserves historically significant buildings, or risk having them drastically altered or destroyed, according to Jeremy Mouat, president of Fredericton Heritage Trust.

"There's a ton of development and a lot of the sort of large development areas have now had their future mapped out.

"And in this context, we really would like to see some sort of review to establish how effective the heritage program has been and are there ways to ensure its effectiveness going forward as we basically lose a fair bit of empty space to development downtown?"

Mouat is also one of five council-appointed board members on the Heritage Preservation Review Board, which ensures the city's heritage preservation bylaw is being followed.

However, only about 300 structures have official heritage status or are part of the St. Anne's Point Heritage Area, and therefore protected by the bylaw.

Some buildings on St. John Street were constructed in the mid-19th century, yet don't fall within the St. Anne's Point Heritage Preservation Area and therefore aren't protected. (Aidan Cox/CBC)

That means the board has little to no say in any modifications or renovations done to the roughly 2,000 other buildings across the city that he says have historical significance.

That includes St. John Street, with its mix of brightly coloured, tightly packed homes that hark back to the development style of the mid-19th century.

"Lots of streetscapes, in our view, need protection," Mouat said. "I mean, if you walk around where I live on St. John Street, down Charlotte Street, Needham, lots of other places, you see charming streetscapes that are the envy of lots of other cities in Canada.

"And what we're anxious about is the fate of these streetscapes, as development pressures are going to pick up, particularly in terms of the need to densify housing and to add on and, you know, subdivide more and more of the older buildings into apartments."

Mouat said his group isn't opposed to the buildings being renovated and used for apartments, "but we're anxious that ultimately that's going to lead to, to wear and tear that would ultimately lead to, to demolition."

Mouat says some homes on Needham Street are historically significant but don't have any heritage protections. (Aidan Cox/CBC)

Request brought before councillors

On Monday, Doug Wright, chair of the heritage board, made a presentation to Fredericton city council on the group's work since 2021 and recommended council "establish a comprehensive heritage program review" to ensure it aligns with provincial regulations and council priorities.

"It would offer an opportunity for council to consider the broad heritage program in the light of the rapid development now occurring in Fredericton," Wright said.

His recommendation led to a motion by Coun. Margo Sheppard to direct city staff to undertake a heritage program review, including design guideline recommendations and potential amendments to the heritage bylaw prior to the south core plan being done.

The motion generated discussion among councillors, with some in support, and other against it.

Coun. Jason Lejeune said it's important to put the heritage review ahead of the south core plan being done.

"I think getting this done will inform a lot of our work to be done under the south core plan and it's important to get it done ahead of that time primarily to avoid any unintended consequences that could come down the road," he said.

Coun. Bruce Grandy said he couldn't support the motion, noting that staff indicated they were already busy with getting the south core plan done.

"They're tasked with a great load at this particular moment in time. Not only that, the construction and permitting that's going on and the amount of development that's happening," Grandy said.

"If it was a staff recommendation I certainly would support it but understanding what I just asked previous, and the work that they're involved in with the limited staff, I won't support the motion."

The motion was defeated 7-4, but councillors agreed to have the issue sent to the economic vitality committee for further consideration.

Dwindling heritage stock

If a property owner wants to tear down a building with historical significance, council has the opportunity to step in and grant it heritage status.

However, councillors still voted in 2019 against giving heritage status to the Risteen building, effectively giving the developer who owned it the right to tear it down.

Sheppard said with the city set to grow in population, and housing needs to continue growing, she fears more buldings will meet the same fate.

The Risteen building was demolished in 2019 after councillors voted against granting it status under the heritage preservation bylaw. (Mike Heenan/CBC)

"Being the capital city, as Fredericton is, we really need to be cognizant that, that our heritage is, is dwindling," Sheppard said.

"We have many heritage buildings that are not protected in any way. Some have national significance, some have provincial significance, and, you know, we can we can decide that we want to create an environment where people want to keep heritage buildings."

Sheppard said a broad review of the city's heritage strategy could result in incentives from the city to encourage property owners to preserve a building's defining features.

A review could also result in more buildings being better recognized for their heritage value, she said.

"The [heritage] preservation bylaw hasn't really resulted in too too many neighbourhoods being designated for one reason or another.

"And, you know, maybe it's time we took a look at the, at that process and also look at other things that have been over the last 20 years or so ... recommended but never acted upon."

ABOUT THE AUTHOR

Aidan Cox

Web reporter/editor

Aidan Cox is a web writer for the CBC based in Fredericton. He can be reached at aidan.cox@cbc.ca and followed on Twitter @Aidan4jrn.

CBC's Journalistic Standards and Practices

 

https://wp.stu.ca/thirdagecentre/ 

 

 

 

The Third Age Centre is an autonomous, community-based, non-profit organization, housed at Saint Thomas University.

The Centre’s membership is predominantly made up of older adults (50+). However, an interest in, and a concern for, the issues that affect aging is of primary importance for all members.

The Centre was established in 1991 under the auspices of the Chair in Gerontology at Saint Thomas University. It is now an independent organization, although Saint Thomas continues its support by providing office space, and in kind support.

The mission of the Third Age Centre is to empower older adults to maintain healthy, independent, active lifestyles.

The mandate is to do research and public education on seniors’ issues, and to act as an advocate on behalf of seniors.

The Third Age Centre maintains close links with like-minded local, regional and national organizations.

 

Board of Directors for 2021-2022

Heather Lunergan (President)

Albert Banerjee (Vice President)

Wiggins, Nancy (Past President)

Secretary-Vacant

McFarland, Joan (STU Faculty Rep.)

Anne Doyle (Treasurer)

Jordan-Arsenault, Brooklyn (STU Student Rep.)

Eleanor McCloskey

Kissick, Doreen

Pacey, Penny

Contact:

(506) 452-0526
3rdage@stu.ca

 

https://www.heritagefredericton.org/about-us 

 

Fredericton Heritage Trust is a volunteer non-profit, charitable organization dedicated to promoting the preservation of the natural, historical, and architectural heritage of the Capital Region of New Brunswick.

The Trust has launched many successful endeavours over the years, including walking tour booklets of both Fredericton and Marysville and a restoration guidebook to Fredericton's residential architecture.

Annually, the Trust presents awards to businesses and individuals for their efforts in restoring and maintaining our architectural heritage. Various educational projects and programs are also ongoing regularly.

We have an active volunteer board and hold monthly meetings. These meetings are open to the public and any interested party is invited to attend.

The Trust welcomes new members and new ideas... Please contact us.

Our Mandate

  • To preserve, protect and promote the heritage of Fredericton and area.

  • To identify and recognize examples of heritage preservation.

  • To educate the public (especially children) as to the importance of our built and natural heritage.

Executive Director: Anthea Plummer antheaplummer@gmail.com

Board Members 2022

  • Executive:

  • President: Jeremy Mouat, Professor Emeritus, University of Alberta

  • Past President: Richard Bird, Retired Professor of Law, UNB

  • Vice President:

  • Secretary:

  • Treasurer: Ian Baird, PhD Student, Department of History, UNB

Board Members:

  • Marion Beyea, Retired Provincial Archivist (NB)

  • Gwendolyn Davies, Professor and Dean Emerita, UNB

  • Margo Sheppard, Fredericton City Councillor for Ward 1

  • Ellen Wilson Messenger, B.Ed., M.Sc (Aud), Heritage Home Owner

  • Monika Berenyi, Lawyer, McInnes Cooper

  • Bronwyn Coates Bonney, Student Intervention Coordinator, Student Services, UNB

  • Ian Robertson, Retired Architect, B.Arch. (NSTC/DAL), AANB

  • Richard Bird, Retired Professor of Law, UNB

  • Richard Russell

  • Thomas Gonder, Music Director, Christ Church Cathedral

Advisors:

  • Drummond Bowden, Professor Emeritus, Faculty of Medicine, UManitoba

  • Barbara Hughes Campbell, Q.C., Lawyer &amp; Heritage Home Owner

  • Robert Dallison, Lt. Col. (Ret.)/History Researcher &amp; Author

  • Hart North, Businessman

  • Peter Pacey, Owner of the Calithumpians

 

https://apps.ualberta.ca/directory/person/jmouat 

 

Jeremy Mouat

Contact

Augustana - Social Sciences
Email
jeremy.mouat@ualberta.ca

 

Western Labor and Working Class History

History professors talked about how they became interested in labor and working class history and how best to bring that topic into universities.

00:00:00

YOU CAN WATCH THIS AND OTHER AMERICAN ARTIFACTS PROGRAMS BY VISITING OUR WEBSITE AT C-SPAN.ORG/HISTORY.

00:00:00

COMING UP NEXT, SEVEN HISTORY PROFESSORS DISCUSS THE STATE OF THE FIELD FOR LABOR AND WORKING-CLASS HISTORY IN THE WEST. THEY ALSO EXPLORE SOME OF THE PRIMARY...

Show Full Text

 



https://twitter.com/DavidRayAmos/with_replies





Replying to and 49 others
Oh My My Methinks you should ask yourself why my reply to you was blocked N'esy Pas?


https://davidraymondamos3.blogspot.com/2019/01/fate-of-1820s-stone-building-in.html



https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/risteen-heritage-fredericton-1.4993884 

 

---------- Original message ----------
From: "Gallant, Brian (LEG)" <Brian.Gallant@gnb.ca>
Date: Sat, 26 Jan 2019 16:29:24 +0000
Subject: RE: YO Marcus Kingston I just called but you were too busy
having coffee
to talk to me about your concerns about the Risteen building
To: David Amos <motomaniac333@gmail.com>

Thank you for writing to the Leader of the Official Opposition of New
Brunswick. Please be assured that your e-mail will be reviewed.

If this is a media request, please forward your e-mail to
ashley.beaudin@gnb.camedia-medias@gnb.ca
>. Thank you!

---

Nous vous remercions d’avoir communiqué avec le chef de l’opposition
officielle du Nouveau-Brunswick.  Soyez assuré(e) que votre courriel
sera examiné.

Si ceci est une demande médiatique, prière de la transmettre à
ashley.beaudin@gnb.camedia-medias@gnb.ca>.  Merci!





---------- Original message ----------
From: Newsroom <newsroom@globeandmail.com>
Date: Sat, 26 Jan 2019 16:29:26 +0000
Subject: Automatic reply: YO Marcus Kingston I just called but you
were too busy having coffee to talk to me about your concerns about
the Risteen building
To: David Amos <motomaniac333@gmail.com>

Thank you for contacting The Globe and Mail.

If your matter pertains to newspaper delivery or you require technical
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1-800-387-5400 or send an email to customerservice@globeandmail.com

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This is the correct email address for requests for news coverage and
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---------- Original message ----------
From: David Amos <motomaniac333@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 26 Jan 2019 12:29:19 -0400
Subject: YO Marcus Kingston I just called but you were too busy having coffee
to talk to me about your concerns about the Risteen building
To: marcus.kingston@gnb.ca, mike.obrien@fredericton.ca,
blaine.higgs@gnb.ca, oldmaison@yahoo.com, andre@jafaust.com,
jbosnitch@gmail.com, David.Coon@gnb.ca, kris.austin@gnb.ca,
brian.gallant@gnb.ca, robert.gauvin@gnb.ca, premier@gnb.ca,
Matt.DeCourcey.c1@parl.gc.ca, bruce@downtownfredericton.ca,
dfi@downtownfredericton.ca, markandcaroline@gmail.com,
martin.gaudet@fredericton.ca,
Larry.Tremblay@rcmp-grc.gc.ca, Gilles.Blinn@rcmp-grc.gc.ca,
Stephen.Chase@fredericton.ca, info@bellaproperties.ca
Cc: david.raymond.amos@gmail.com, Jacques.Poitras@cbc.ca,
steve.murphy@ctv.caNewsroom@globeandmail.com


However I did tell what I was up to Correct?

Perhaps Chucky Lebalnc and his cohorts will take up your battles with
Fat Fred City with his buddy Premier Blaine Higgs and Hon. Robert
Gauvin in particular N'esy Pas?

https://www2.gnb.ca/content/gnb/en/departments/thc/heritage/content/historic_places/designations.html

Heritage Designations in New Brunswick
Through the Heritage Conservation Act, the province is involved in a
number of procedures that can result in different types of heritage
designations. Depending on the level and nature of significance,
places in New Brunswick may be eligible for recognition under the
following types of designations:

•Provincial Heritage Place Designation
•Municipal Heritage Conservation Area
•Local Historic Place Designation
Provincial Heritage Places and Local Historic Places are listed on the
New Brunswick Register of Historic Places and on the Canadian Register
of Historic Places. Information on the Canadian Register of Historic
Places is available at www.HistoricPlaces.ca. For National Historic
Sites and related information, contact Parks Canada Agency web site,
click here.

https://oldmaison.wordpress.com/2011/12/13/north-start-bar-sold-to-gabriel-el-zayat-for-400000-plans-more-than-66-apartment-units/


Tuesday
Dec13  2011


North Start bar sold to Gabriel El-Zayat for $400,000. Plans more than
66 apartment units!!!!

thought on “North Start bar sold to Gabriel El-Zayat for $400,000.
Plans more than 66 apartment units!!!!”

December 14, 2011 at 3:17 pm

    Triumph26 said:

    Isn't it great that this Smart City we live in sold this club for
$125,000 less than they paid to a known slum landlord. There were
several other solutions to this issue.

 


https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/risteen-heritage-fredericton-1.4993884 

Fate of 1820s stone building in Fredericton causes worry

Owner wants to put up new apartments on property in downtown Fredericton


The Risteen Sash and Door factory was established in the 1870s in one of the first stone cut buildings in New Brunswick. (Provincial Archives)

Concern is growing for an old stone building in downtown Fredericton, once the home of a thriving woodworking factory and now possibly headed for demolition.

The Risteen building at the corner of Queen and Smythe streets, the first cut stone building in New Brunswick, could be torn down to make way for a new development.

Gabriel Elzayat says he wants to put apartments on the property.

The prospect saddens Carl Risteen, great-grandson of Joseph Risteen, who took the building over in the 1870s.

"This building here is the cornerstone basically of Queen Street, so it's the first house in Queen Street," Risteen said.

He still lives in the house that his great-grandfather built adjacent to the building.


The Risteen building was erected in the 1820s but Joseph Risteen turned it into a woodworking plant toward the end of the 19th century. (Jon Collicotte CBC News)

"It would be a shame to see it gone," he said.

It was built in the 1820s by Anthony Lockwood, surveyor general of New Brunswick. When Joseph Ristine took it over, he created the Risteen Sash and Door factory.

"My great-grandfather bought the burned-out shell in about 1870 or thereabouts and fixed up the interior and built the big extension on the back — the big wooden part on the back — for his woodworking factory," Risteen said.

The products of that factory can still be found in the finishings and doorways of the New Brunswick Legislature, said Risteen.


Carl Risteen's great-grandfather created the Risteen Sash and Door factory. (Jon Collicott CBC News)

But the building itself may not last much longer. It's one of several buildings developer Elzayat has acquired on the block.

He said he's not sure whether the building will be torn down or salvaged, but he's open to ideas about incorporating it into his new development.

The city said it hasn't received an application for development yet, but tenants are already on the move.
Ross Davidson, whose kitchen supply shop has been in the building for decades, has been told to vacate by the end of February.

"We got a notice from our landlord that the property was going to be redeveloped and that was it," Davidson said.


Marcus Kingston wants to find a way to save the Risteen building in Fredericton. (Jon Collicott CBC News)

Some are worried about what the loss of the building will mean for the city's heritage.
Heritage enthusiast Marcus Kingston wants to find a way to save it.

"It's been sitting on the spot for … nearly 200 years and it deserves to stay," he said.

Despite its history, there's no heritage designation to protect the Risteen building, which means developers are free to do whatever they want with it.




79 Comments 
Commenting is now closed for this story.


  

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
Cheer up Carl the Fat Lady ain't sung yet







 Shawn McShane 
Shawn McShane
Developers are learning that heritage buildings can be money-makers. 80 per cent of millennials “would rather spend money at businesses supporting efforts to preserve and protect buildings, architecture and neighbourhoods over those that don’t. They also choose to shop and eat in “historic downtowns . . . and places with historic appeal . . . over malls and planned commercial districts or recently constructed places.”


David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Shawn McShane Methinks everybody knows why that I would not bet the farm on your opinions N'esy Pas?

Shawn McShane
Shawn McShane
@David R. Amos Not my opinion. A U.S. study commissioned by the National Trust for Historic Preservation, Edge Research and the American Express Foundation.

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Shawn McShane Methinks you know what I think of Yankee opinions However I bet you didn't know that my wife was one of the top travel agents working American Express years ago N'esy Pas?









Shawn McShane 
Johnny Horton
That’s Gabriel’s style. No respect for his tenants, or history,

He has a bad habit of letting leases expiring and then telling you to get out, a kids any calls or visits to his office she discuss your lease.


Johnny Horton
Johnny Horton
@Johnny Horton

** avoids (not a kids)

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Johnny Horton Too Funny










 Shawn McShane 
Ken Stephens
If someone owns a property and wants to tear down a very old building like this it's his decision to make, not ours. Perhaps these people who are upset by this can all chip in and buy it from him. The way these things work is that something is there for a while but eventually becomes too old and it gets replaced, and we end up with more value out of the deal as well.


Johnny Horton
Johnny Horton
@Ken Stephens

Yep value. That’s all that matters. Gotta Aximize that tax base!

yep money, that’s all that matters. Gotta own every property!

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Ken Stephens Yea Right

Marcus Kingston
Marcus Kingston
@Ken Stephens - It's clear that some people in Fredericton seem to care very little about the built heritage that surrounds us, and makes our city unique. However, there are equally those who do care. The issue shouldn't always come down to how much tax revenue can be gained from a new building. We have a moral obligation to retain certain structures for the enjoyment of future generations. I'm not against all new builds, it can be a part of growing a strong and vibrant city I agree. So too is maintaining what's already here. Perhaps we should tear down Christ Church Cathedral and put the new Starbucks there instead of in Kings Place? It could draw more people to that area of the city.

Respectfully

MK

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Marcus Kingston Hmmm









Shawn McShane 
Mack Leigh
One thing I greatly admire about many European countries, Great Britain and New England, USA is that they preserve their historical buildings, statues, trees, etc. ..... Way to quick now to tear down, cut down or remove important pieces of our history.... Hopefully they will be able to save this landmark..


Johnny Horton
Johnny Horton
@Mack Leigh

Gabriel is buying up and taking all the land in the area. Not much chance he’ll save it, or sell it t a preservation group.

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Johnny Horton So you say









 Shawn McShane 
Mack Leigh
We have become a ...throw a way ..... society ....... No thought to the preservation of anything..


David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Mack Leigh YUP

Alex Butt
Alex Butt
@Mack Leigh Yes we have become a disposable society, but we have to face facts that New Brunswick is broke and unfortunately there are bigger issues that require funding!

Mack Leigh
Mack Leigh
@Alex Butt

There are ways to preserve our historical buildings and turn them into money makers.... Erasing our historical buildings is a sad statement as to what society has become and the direction it is headed..

David R. Amos
Content disabled.
David R. Amos
@Mack Leigh YUP

Shawn McShane
Shawn McShane
@Alex Butt Historical places bring in tourists and locals. To be honest I am sick of beautiful old buildings full of character being torn down and replaced with cheap looking construction with a 40 yr life. Why not turn the building into apartments? Sell them. Sell a piece of history.

Louie Youssef
Louie Youssef
@Mack Leigh What's sad about it? It's sad to move forward? I don't think anyone who puts up a building thinks it will be around forever.

Shawn McShane
Shawn McShane
@Louie Youssef Obviously the Pharisees did, those pyramids are still around.

Jim Cyr
Jim Cyr
@Louie Youssef But Mack's point is valid: we absolutely have become a throwaway society. In fact, the expectation now for any building put up by a government entity is that it will last 40 years. (It's right in the specs/contracts). 40 years!! That number used to be at least 75 years when I was a kid.

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Shawn McShane Methinks you meant the Pharaohs N'esy Pas?

Shawn McShane
Shawn McShane
@David R. Amos Lols Yes Pharaohs


Alex Butt
Alex Butt
@Shawn McShane I agree but we have to face the fact that NB is broke, and not that many people travel to Fredericton to see the old buildings. Unless someone with lots of cash is willing to buy it, then we shouldn't complain that someone wants the land to build something and make money.

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Alex Butt Methinks you are a bit redundant N'esy Pas?








Shawn McShane 
Alex Butt
I love the heritage idea, and everyone is all for keeping such buildings, yet no one is willing to face the hard facts that it will cost lots of money and very few are willing to put their money where their mouth is. Perfect example was the Fredericton train station. Everyone cried to keep the falling apart eye sore, and who ended up paying for it? The tax payers did. Time to wake up and realize that NB is broke and falling apart and need to set real priorities!


David R. Amos
Content disabled.
David R. Amos
@Alex Butt "Time to wake up and realize that NB is broke and falling apart"

Methinks we got the governments we deserve because we overslept N'esy Pas?

David R. Amos
Content disabled.
David R. Amos
@Alex Butt Oh My My Methinks you should ask yourself why my reply to you was blocked N'esy Pas?


David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Alex Butt "Perfect example was the Fredericton train station. Everyone cried to keep the falling apart eye sore, and who ended up paying for it? The tax payers did."

Methinks the Irving Clan didn't cry N'esy Pas?


Grant Buote
Grant Buote
@David R. Amos - quick question: why do you keep say "N'esy Pas"? What, exactly , are you trying to say?

Ian Scott
Ian Scott
@Alex Butt And now its a booze store. At our expense.

David R. Amos
Content disabled.
David R. Amos
@Grant Buote Its Chiac

Now Go Figure Who is crazy and who is not

http://www.biographi.ca/en/bio/lockwood_anthony_8E.html

However, the political crisis following Lieutenant Governor Smyth’s death on 27 March provided the occasion, if not the inducement, for Lockwood’s spectacular descent into madness.

An interim president of the Council being required, George Leonard*, the octogenarian senior member, was first offered the position, which he declined on the grounds of age. Despite a challenge by supporters of Christopher Billopp, Ward Chipman* assumed the post of administrator on 1 April. The challenges continued however. Lockwood attended the Council meetings on 30 April and on 1 May. Thereafter he absented himself and for the next few weeks his whereabouts are uncertain. By 24 May he had persuaded Leonard to assert his right to the presidency “in the hope that it would produce tranquillity in the province.” Ostensibly to assist in that purpose, Lockwood appointed himself as Leonard’s civil aide-de-camp and inspecting field officer, as well as acting secretary. On 25 May he attempted to disseminate Leonard’s proclamation in Saint John – while at the same time writing a letter to Chipman offering terms for his, Lockwood’s, support. From 25 to 30 May Lockwood behaved with erratic violence in Saint John: issuing threats, brawling, taking up residence in Government House, and gathering an appreciative mob. Dr Paddock attended him with scant success. By the time he returned to Fredericton on 30 May, Lockwood was approaching collapse; on the steamboat General Smyth he scribbled a desperate note to Chipman requesting release from his present public offices since his “ailment” was “subject to increase from confinement.”

David R. Amos
Content disabled.
David R. Amos
@Grant Buote continued

The Council considered Lockwood’s state of mind at their meeting on 31 May, hearing depositions from the doctors who had treated him and from the mayor of Saint John. The following day Lockwood set up a table in Fredericton square, at which he drank coffee, issued proclamations, and reacted pugnaciously to the crowd, before taking horse and riding about the streets firing pistols and declaring himself called to assume the government of the province. By nightfall Lockwood had been arrested and placed in the Fredericton jail. The Council received further evidence from the sheriff of York County on 2 June and were “fully satisfied” of Lockwood’s derangement. Chipman appointed a commission de lunatico inquirendo that day and by 5 June it had determined that Lockwood was legally mad, and had been since 19 May. On 7 June his wife and son petitioned for a committee of custody over his person and estate, which was immediately granted.

When George Shore, Lockwood’s replacement, examined the surveyor general’s office, he found confusion, mutilated documents, and disarray which would take “two extra employees five years to straighten out.” Furthermore, the discrepancy between Lockwood’s receipts as receiver general and the office’s bank deposit amounted to more than £2,000. Although he was moved from the jail to what was, in effect, house-arrest in September, Lockwood and his family had to suffer the public sale of his real and personal estate as the custodial committee sought to recover the missing public monies.



David R. Amos
Content disabled.
David R. Amos
@Alex Butt "Time to wake up and realize that NB is broke and falling apart and need to set real priorities!"

Methinks history can repeat itself The province has seized control of the Lockwood house before N'esy Pas?

http://www.biographi.ca/en/bio/lockwood_anthony_8E.html

The following day Lockwood set up a table in Fredericton square, at which he drank coffee, issued proclamations, and reacted pugnaciously to the crowd, before taking horse and riding about the streets firing pistols and declaring himself called to assume the government of the province. By nightfall Lockwood had been arrested and placed in the Fredericton jail. The Council received further evidence from the sheriff of York County on 2 June and were “fully satisfied” of Lockwood’s derangement. Chipman appointed a commission de lunatico inquirendo that day and by 5 June it had determined that Lockwood was legally mad, and had been since 19 May. On 7 June his wife and son petitioned for a committee of custody over his person and estate, which was immediately granted.

When George Shore, Lockwood’s replacement, examined the surveyor general’s office, he found confusion, mutilated documents, and disarray which would take “two extra employees five years to straighten out.” Furthermore, the discrepancy between Lockwood’s receipts as receiver general and the office’s bank deposit amounted to more than £2,000. Although he was moved from the jail to what was, in effect, house-arrest in September, Lockwood and his family had to suffer the public sale of his real and personal estate as the custodial committee sought to recover the missing public monies.

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Grant Buote Methinks you should ask Fat Fred City's infamous blogger or his buddy the Mayor to explain my Chiac to you N'esy Pas?

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Grant Buote Methinksin return I should ask an Urban Planning Technologist if he recalls why I ran in Fat Fred City for a seat in the 39th Parliament Trust that Chucky and Mikey know N'esy Pas?









 Shawn McShane 
Emilien Forest
He owns it, he should be able to do with the way he wants. The Fredericton elite wanna be's should learn to respect that. Enjoy your herbal tea now...


David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Emilien Forest How do you spell R.E.S.P.E.C.T ??? Methinks you and your foes the Fredericton elite wanna be's have no clue as to what I am up to N'esy Pas?

Marc LeBlanc
Marc LeBlanc
@Emilien Forest There should be some kind of prize for this post!!!
Finally someone with my sense of humor...now watch we'll get bumped

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Marc LeBlanc I have already been bumped twice










 Shawn McShane 
Louie Youssef
Those properties were listed, and for sale for a very long time. Anyone who wanted to save them, or do anything else with them, could have bought them. Just because something is old, it doesn't mean it should stay around forever.

Why should anyone have the right to dictate what all future generations do with private property? There are people around who just love to have a cause to champion, and that's fair. But when someone spends their time, money and energy taking a risk on something, it's not right to try and change the rules of the game, mid game. If tearing down old, inefficient, obsolete buildings was prevented, New York city would never have been built.

It's called progress. Getting rid of something to build something better, that will provide badly needed housing, shouldn't be discouraged.


Emilien Forest
Emilien Forest
@Louie Youssef

Well said!


Jason jeandron
Jason jeandron
@Louie Youssef It's that attitude that saw corporations dump hazardous waste into watercourses, destroy wetlands and pollute the atmosphere a few decades ago. Heritage is a community asset which provides well documented advantages when preserved. Improved community, increased economic benefits from taxes, tourism and jobs creation. And while they fail to follow it, the City has committed to conserving our heritage in their Municipal Plan. As you'll be aware, the City/Province/Nation often has a say in how development occurs, to prevent the loss of life, environment and increasingly heritage. Allowing developers to destroy iur heritage, that others have helped to survive for nearly 2 centuries in this case, is short-sighted. There are other places that developers can build in that will not destroy our non-renewable heritage resources.

Marcus Kingston
Marcus Kingston
@Louie Youssef@Louie Youssef I respect your response, however I also respectfully disagree with your response. This building is old yes, but it has extreme heritage value to the city and the province. People come to Fredericton to see these structures and admire their craftsmanship and design. The New York City that you speak of actually 'landmarks' many of their historic structures as the realize their importance to the history and culture of their city.

If city planners in Fredericton had had their way in the 1960's/70's then the entirety of Queen Street including City Hall would have been demolished. How would this have benefited Fredericton in the long run? Are you aware of how many tour busses stop outside of City Hall on any given day in the summer months?

Last summer we lost two 'beautiful' yellow homes on Regent Street, heritage homes that could have easily been saved, when there was an open lot just up the street on the corner of Charlotte and Regent. Tourists will be less and less inclined to visit Fredericton if we keep erasing it's past. I'm all for 'progress ' as you say, however progress isn't always 'moving forward'. I welcome new builds, many of us do, but why can they not be built on existing lots that are already vacant? Or put in places that do not already have historic structures.

Heritage should belong to us all, not simply those who can afford to own it.

If I had had $7,000,000 then I would have purchased all of these properties and saved them. However only a few people can afford to do such things. I'm sure no one jumped on these purchases because no one would have assumed that a buyer would demolish them. St. Dunstan's was turned into apartments as was York House, restoration is possible, you can mix old and new.

Respectfully,

MK

Louie Youssef
Louie Youssef
@Marcus Kingston You're making an awful lot of assumptions. Two homes were destroyed, you have no idea what condition they were in, or what was needed to make them efficient. I do, because I owned them.
Now 16 families will be able to live where previously 3 could. You take a very simplistic view of development. It's not up to just one person to say "oh, there's some vacant property, I think I'll have it and build something". That's not how it works. Not everything can be saved, for both practical and financial reasons.

Cities are growing, and everyone has a right to live in them. Just because a few people think something is pretty, it doesn't mean that saving that house, and denying many others the right to live in a city is the best thing to do. It's not right to target a specific development that doesn't have any restrictions of demolition on it after the fact. That's a policy that needs to be in place before investment is made.

I'm against it, but I respect what the majority says. That's how a democratic society works.


Shawn McShane
Shawn McShane
@Louie Youssef New York City held onto a significant number of structures that date all the way back to the middle of the 17th century.

Louie Youssef
Louie Youssef
@Jason jeandron What is heritage exactly? Is it any house that's old? Isn't a house just something made of sticks and stones? I would say that what makes a home important are the memories that are made inside of it.

Those memories are important to the people who made them. Beauty is subjective. Some people may like old architecture, some people may like contemporary. There is no right or wrong. To me, people should be able to do what they like with private property, while respecting the laws that are in place.

As far as pollution, wetlands, etc, I'm not sure why that's part of this commentary. But that's your right.

Shawn McShane
Shawn McShane
@Louie Youssef Do all the neighbors appreciate having 16 families, the noise and traffic? Did it make their own property value go down?

Dundonald Street area property owners say they have enough apartments on their street and they don't want another...Elzayat said he will make two-bedroom units to entice families. "A single family home or an apartment, they're family dwellings. Maybe you should change your thinking on that." - May 20th, 2010

Jim Cyr
Jim Cyr
@Louie Youssef Louie, your point is valid. However, the building is not 100 years old. It's not even 150 years old. It's 200 years old. And we are not Europe; we have very few old buildings.

Jim Cyr
Jim Cyr
@Jim Cyr Oh, and Louie, one more thing: functional apartments can literally be built almost anywhere. That's just a fact of life.

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Emilien Forest Nope

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Marcus Kingston Methinks that you have lots of time to type but not to talk N'esy Pas?


Roy Nicholl
Roy Nicholl
@Louie Youssef wrote
"It's called progress. Getting rid of something to build something better, that will provide badly needed housing, shouldn't be discouraged.:

The problem is that what we are building may be newer, but is not always better. Nor is it even significantly more efficient. Very few of the apartment buildings erected in the City in the past 25 years will see a 100th birthday let alone 200.

With respect to the Risteen Building (Significance of the original portion of the building being it was the first cut stone building in the City (perhaps province) and was the home of New Brunswick's first Surveyor General), I understand Gabriel's conundrum. I had looked at this building (and the surrounding properties) a year or two earlier with the intention of incorporating the Lockwood house into a Passivhaus mixed-use complex, but, in the end, could not reduce the risk sufficiently to move forward.







Shawn McShane
 Colin Seeley
Too bad. Gallant and the money tree is gone.


David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Colin Seeley Nope









Shawn McShane
Here is the problem with all of the comments on this article: People are posting their opinions about the fate of a property, and trying to cast the owner in a bad light, when in reality he is not doing anything wrong.
To the people who are calling this building a “heritage building” – if that is so, why does it not have a designation? Shouldn’t that be your avenue, trying to get a designation, rather than badmouthing law-abiding property owners?
To those who object to building higher density housing, shouldn’t your avenue be to change the zoning bylaws if you want to prevent more apartments in the city, not bashing property owners who are not breaking any rules?
And finally, what makes any of you authorities on what has value and what doesn’t? Your own opinion? Because it doesn’t seem like it is backed by any democratic process.


Jim Cyr
Jim Cyr
@ It's a tourism thing. Tear down enough of these old buildings, to put up bland apartment blocks, and pretty soon people like me stop wanting to visit Fredericton. 1,000 people per year who didn't spend that $1,000 in Fredericton equals a loss per year of one million dollars . Ten million dollars over ten years. It's all about the money: does Fredericton want that ten million dollars, or not?? (If it had no competition, then of course the question would be moot. However, it DOES have competition in the "semi-quaint old cities in New Brunswick and Nova Scotia" category.....Saint John, Moncton and Halifax.)

Shawn McShane
Shawn McShane
@ Anonymous City councils change zoning by-laws to ALLOW higher density in order to collect more money and to collect on NEW building permits. The property owner/developer goes to the the same councils, the developer hears the public complaints and doesn't care as long has he gets approval from the council. He gives not one whit about the public and neither does the council. Follow the money.

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@ Methinks we all should who are you N'esy Pas?










 Shawn McShane 
Jim Cyr
Let me just as you: what kind of city tears down a 200 year-old, perfectly functional building to put up APARTMENTS?? A city that has tons of 200 year-old buildings, I guess.......


Shawn McShane
Shawn McShane
@Jim Cyr Same kind of city that tears town beautiful mature trees at at Officer’s Square against the wishes of the public?

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Jim Cyr Methinks that thou doth jest too much N'esy Pas?

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Shawn McShane And methinks that thou doth protest too much N'esy Pas?










 Shawn McShane 
John Young
Fredericton is turning into pressboard paradise. Structurally sound old buildings systemically torn down for profit and greed. Officer’s Square is being converted to Coney Island, while Main St. looks like Las Vegas Strip. Our city is losing its historical identity and beauty.


David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@John Young YUP









David R. Amos 
David R. Amos
Methinks some folks may enjoy knowing a bit of my conversation that I just had with my friend Carl Risteen N'esy Pas?

In a nutshell Carl said that his home is considered a heritage home and he can't change the colour of even a shingle with Fat Fred City's permission and that the reports of people trying to buy it are pure BS. I told him that he should register with CBC and tell the folks himself Carl said he can't be bothered and was going for a walk and gave me his permission to state this.


Shawn McShane
Shawn McShane
@David R. Amos Carl Risteen lives in the house that his great-grandfather built adjacent to the building and it is heritage but the 200 year old Risteen building itself is not heritage?

Something smells

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Shawn McShane YUP










Ray Bungay 
Ray Bungay
Very simple to per like Heritage enthusiast Mr. Marcus Kingston, is to find out the value of that property now, plus what the value is now, plus the value of the property after the new construction is complete minus the demolition and then make an offer to buy it. I not then leave the owner alone to do what he/they want to do with it. We see this almost yearly here in Saint John most recently the old falling apart Jelly Bean homes and old Sydney Street Court House. Public monies should no be used to save old buildings rather private money should if it can be raised and a specific time frame to fix up or in the end tearing it down. Anyone in Fredericton with very deep pockets? No one showed up in Saint John for the Jelly Bean homes and no private developer has come forth for the court house.


David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Ray Bungay Methinks folks should follow the money right now not after the fact N'esy Pas?










Shawn McShane 
Bob Smith
For those crying and moaning about this, put your money where talk is directed. Want to save the "historic buildings" in Fredericton and St. John? Buy them or allow developers to fix the properties up without red tape and complaints when a single brick is moved or replaced. Media always finds folks like Kingston to interview about this but these same individuals seem to have only words and no money..


David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Bob Smith Methinks Mr Higgs and his Minister of Tourism, Heritage and Culture
Robert Gauvin as Minister of Tourism, Heritage and Culture should step up to the plate and classify it a "historic building" It is located in the Capital District N'esy Pas?

Roy Nicholl
Roy Nicholl
@Bob Smith
Some of us are doing just that.








Shawn McShane  
Trevis L. Kingston
North America has no "old" buildings.
1492...was the starting date of 4 sided structures as we know them on this continent.
A 200 year old structure here is socially as valuable as a 2000 year old Italian Cathedral.
Canadians travel to the four corners of the world to see what?....old buildings !
But we will never have any for tourists to see if we tear them all down.
People pay good money to see Kings Landing and the Acadian Village. (1783 plus.)
Fredericton...the City of Stately...apartment buildings?


Harold Benson
Harold Benson
@Trevis L. Kingston I'll trade ya

David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Harold Benson "Fredericton...the City of Stately...apartment buildings?"

Methinks Mayor Mikey and his cohorts no doubt like the sound of that Perhaps they will change Fat Fred City's slogan N'esy Pas?








Shawn McShane  
Shawn McShane
That building is a brick schitt house. Solid. So replace it with another particle board apartment? There was a developer in Moncton who did the opposite...Heritage Developments Ltd?.


David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Shawn McShane Methinks the latest Minister of Heritage Mr Gauvin is no doubt very proud of Moncton's efforts to preserve it history N'esy Pas?

David R. Amos
Content disabled.
David R. Amos
@Shawn McShane Methinks the folks should checkout the history swirling around the Lockwood House N'esy Pas?

http://www.biographi.ca/en/bio/lockwood_anthony_8E.html








Harold Benson  
Harold Benson
Git them Gagetown boys up here with one of them newfangled tanks. Problem solved, training to boot.


David R. Amos
David R. Amos
@Harold Benson Methinks Sam does not agree with such nonsense N'esy Pas?








David R. Amos  
David R. Amos
Carl Risteen told me to checkout the history swirling around Anthony Lockwood. Methinks because the Receiver General was such a comical scallywag the cornerstone of Queen Street should certainly be preserved and our history become better known N'esy Pas?





David R. Amos
Content disabled.
David R. Amos
The Fat Lady is about to sing Carl I trust that you cheered up and got a chuckle out of the comments

 

 

 

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