Wednesday 29 November 2023

Higgs legislation would force 5 public-sector unions into new pension plan

 
 

PC majority puts another limit on pension bill debate

Government wraps Friday sitting early, after opposition stalls discussion of legislation

The Higgs government cut short debate on controversial pension legislation again Friday, putting another limit on top of the legislature's already restricted consideration of the bill.

The Progressive Conservative majority has already moved to cap discussion of the bill at 10 hours, a limit that will allow for swift final passage of the measure next Tuesday.

On Friday morning the Tories went one step further, voting to adjourn the legislature early for the weekend.

"This is consistent with the way the premier's been acting. He broke his word and the contract," Green Party Leader David Coon said.

"He is determined to go forward with his choice of pension plans no matter what, and he's decided to shut down the house to ensure he can do that." 

Premier Blaine Higgs blamed the opposition Liberals and Greens for the decision to wrap up the day's sitting around 11:30 a.m. rather than the usual 2 p.m. Friday adjournment time.

A balding man with glasses is speaking inside the legislature. Green Party Leader David Coon said the premier's moves to limit debate on the pension bill are breaking his word. (Jacques Poitras/CBC)

"Have you been listening to the level of debate over the last few days?" Higgs asked reporters.

"If you've been listening, what we would hear is a rerun of no real information sharing, or no real opportunity to discuss the actual details of the pension changes."

Earlier, the government asked for the required unanimous consent of all MLAs to wrap up second reading and send the bill to the committee stage for discussion until the 2 p.m. adjournment.

Opposition members refused, so the government moved to adjourn.

In the committee stage, Liberal and Green MLAs would have had the right to question cabinet ministers about the legislation rather than just give speeches.

Ministers in turn would be allowed to consult civil servants when providing answers.

Higgs said that would have been a more informed, substantial discussion.

"The staff were here, ready to go in and — I was going to participate in it is well — and share every piece of information, answer every question. But they don't want to do that," he said.

"I just can't believe that the opposition would turn down the opportunity to understand what it really means to employees. What are they debating about if they don't want to know the facts of what it means?" 

At issue: Shared-risk pension plans

The Pension Plan Sustainability and Transfer Act would force two CUPE locals in the education sector and three groups in the New Brunswick Council of Nursing Home Unions into a process to determine the future of their pension plans.

It requires them to choose one of three different shared-risk pension plans and for the transition to begin by Feb. 1.

Woman with shoulder length blonde hair wearing toque and winter coat approaches barrel with piece of paper to burn. Some CUPE union members protested in front of the legislature in November against the plan to force five public-sector unions into a shared-risk pension plan. (Jacques Poitras/CBC)

The two CUPE locals, representing school custodians, maintenance workers, bus drivers and administrative staff, signed a side agreement on pensions with the province in 2021 at the end of a 16-day strike.

It set up a separate process to resolve the issue.

Last week, Higgs accused the union of dragging its feet and declared it was time to legislate a solution.

CUPE said the contract it signed in 2021 does not allow the province to do that, making the legislation a violation of the agreement and of collective bargaining rights.

Threat of illegal strikes

Union officials warned this weekend that some members could strike illegally in response to the bill, though so far there's been no sign of that. 

On Thursday, education officials in the anglophone education sector sent a memo to school staff warning them they could be fired if they take any illegal job action, including "work-to-rule or unusual call-ins for sick leave." 

Higgs acknowledged that work-to-rule, which means doing the minimum work required under a labour contract as a former of protest, might not actually be illegal. 

"I guess it depends to what extent, how far it went," he said. "It says 'may constitute' an illegal strike, so we would ask for an interpretation of that."

Liberal leader Susan Holt said the memo was premature and will create unnecessary anxiety.

"It's a shame they have to send a letter like that because the premier can't negotiate in a fair way."

Friday's early adjournment means the debate on the bill is effectively over.

The motion capping debate at 10 hours will get a vote next Tuesday, but it will apply retroactively to the time already spent on the bill — and MLAs have already devoted more than 10 hours to it.

That means once the motion passes, MLAs will immediately vote on all remaining stages of the bill itself with no further discussion. 

"This is it," Coon said. "It's done." 

ABOUT THE AUTHOR


Jacques Poitras

Provincial Affairs reporter

Jacques Poitras has been CBC's provincial affairs reporter in New Brunswick since 2000. He grew up in Moncton and covered Parliament in Ottawa for the New Brunswick Telegraph-Journal. He has reported on every New Brunswick election since 1995 and won awards from the Radio Television Digital News Association, the National Newspaper Awards and Amnesty International. He is also the author of five non-fiction books about New Brunswick politics and history.

CBC's Journalistic Standards and Practices
 
 
 
56 Comments
 
 
 
David Amos 
"On Friday morning the Tories went one step further, voting to adjourn the legislature early for the weekend."

Ain't that special? 

  

Lou Bell 
 
 "The leaders of the Greens and Liberals have not been asked why they are not pushing for the much bet..." 


Wilbur Ross 
Reply to Lou Bell 
Bahahahaha .... Judges and MLAs fought like hell to keep their DB plan. 
 
 
 
 
Donald Gallant 
Frank McKenna was very good at cancelling contracts with those in the medical fields .

Higgs is a lightweight compared to those days.

 
Wilbur Ross 
Reply to Donald Gallant
Higgs has kicked a hornets nest just like Frank. And for no good reason. 
 
 
David Amos     
Reply to Wilbur Ross 
Methinks you enjoy the circus as much as I N'esy Pas? 
 
 
 
 
Wilbur Ross
Once again Higgs wipes his A with the Canadian Constitution. Tory voters love it so.  
 
 
David Amos     
Reply to Wilbur Ross 
Oh My My
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

Government could extend legislature sitting to pass union pension bill

Green Party says it will use every procedural tool it has to block legislation

The Higgs government says it's willing to extend the legislature's sitting days closer to Christmas if that's what it takes to pass a bill on five union pension plans.

House leader Glen Savoie says he wants an agreement with opposition parties to sit past the scheduled Dec. 8 adjournment to debate the legislation, which would force the unions to shift their pensions to a shared-risk system.

"We're open to discussions and seeing if the opposition needs more time on this bill," he said. "We're happy to talk about it."

But Green MLA Kevin Arseneau warned in the legislature that his party plans to do everything it can to block the legislation.

"I can guarantee you that our team will use every tool that we can to send this bill where it belongs — the garbage," he said.

The bill would force two locals of the Canadian Union of Public Employees and three groups under the New Brunswick Council of Nursing Home Unions into a negotiating process on their pensions.

But that process would allow only one outcome: a shift starting Feb. 1, 2024 into a shared-risk system like most other provincial employees.

The unions involved say it amounts to Premier Blaine Higgs breaking the contracts they negotiated at the end of a 16-day strike in 2021.

"I would like the opposition parties to support the unions all across this province and truly, all across this country, and say no to this legislation going through," said CUPE 1253 president Iris Lloyd.

Iris Lloyd poses for a photo  Iris Lloyd, president of New Brunswick CUPE Local 1253, is against the legislation and says it amounts to the government breaking already-negotiated contracts. (Jacques Poitras/CBC News)

The legislation is one of only three government bills introduced this fall that hasn't received third reading — the final step before becoming law with royal assent.

Even so, time is short.

The opposition could drag out the debate all next week, because each MLA has the right to speak for 40 minutes on the bill and another 40 minutes on each proposed amendment.

Arseneau predicted Friday morning that Savoie would introduce a motion to put a time limit on the debate, but he didn't do that. 

"That's definitely a tool that government has, but that's not what we're talking about right now," Savoie said.

"I think you would be foolish or foolhardy to say 'I have a tool and I'm not going to use it.' It's whether or not we can come to any sort of negotiated agreement that makes sense, that we wouldn't need it." 

Arseneau said the offer to sit beyond Dec. 8 amounts to "theatrics" by a government "so that the population has a sense that it's been debated." 

Savoie said he plans to meet with the opposition parties next Tuesday to try to sort out a timeline.

 Guy Arsenault speaks to reportersLiberal house leader Guy Arsenault said government could have done more to reach a deal with the unions. (Jacques Poitras/CBC News)

Liberal house leader Guy Arseneault said the government should have done more to reach a deal with the unions without resorting to legislation. 

"To bring it to the legislature is not the right move. It should have been negotiated." 

But since that's the route the Higgs government chose, he said, the Liberals won't feel bound by any timeline. 

"We're not playing hostage to a date. … If they want to bring to the house and debate it, well, we're going to debate it."

Arseneault would not go as far as the Green commitment to throw up procedural obstacles to the bill. 

A man with short brown hair and black glasses. He is wearing a light blue suit jacket, a polka-dotted white dress shirt and a dusty pink tie. Green MLA Kevin Arseneau said the government's move to sit past the Dec. 8 date amounts to theatrics. (Ed Hunter/CBC)

But he said Liberal MLAs are hearing from union members in their ridings "asking us to speak on it," so they will. 

"We're going to debate it to the extent that we have to. Full debate."

The two CUPE locals represent about 7,200 school custodians, maintenance workers, bus drivers and administrative staff.

Three groups of nursing home employees coming under the New Brunswick Council of Nursing Home Unions are also covered by the legislation.

Woman with shoulder length blonde hair wearing toque and winter coat approaches barrel with piece of paper to burn. Some CUPE members, including Kimberly Copp of the New Brunswick Council of Nursing Home Unions, ripped pages from their collective agreement Wednesday morning and tossed them into a fire in a metal barrel on the front lawn of the legislature. (Jacques Poitras/CBC)

During a major CUPE strike in 2021, Higgs wanted the two school unions to agree to a shared-risk pension plan like the one most other public sector employees are in.

Instead they struck a side deal to end the strike but keep talking about the pensions, and to turn to third-party actuaries to settle the pension issue if they couldn't reach a deal.

Higgs said time has run out on that process, but the union says there's nothing in their existing collective agreement that lets the province impose a resolution like the one in the bill.

ABOUT THE AUTHOR


Jacques Poitras

Provincial Affairs reporter

Jacques Poitras has been CBC's provincial affairs reporter in New Brunswick since 2000. He grew up in Moncton and covered Parliament in Ottawa for the New Brunswick Telegraph-Journal. He has reported on every New Brunswick election since 1995 and won awards from the Radio Television Digital News Association, the National Newspaper Awards and Amnesty International. He is also the author of five non-fiction books about New Brunswick politics and history.

CBC's Journalistic Standards and Practices
 
 
 

Higgs legislation would force 5 public-sector unions into new pension plan

Workers say premier’s bill breaks contract by forcing them into shared-risk system

The Higgs government has introduced legislation to force five public-sector unions into shared-risk pension plans, hoping to wrap up a big piece of unfinished business from a major strike in 2021.

To end that dispute, two locals of the Canadian Union of Public Employees signed a side deal that set aside a sticking point over pensions and created a process to resolve it.

Now, Premier Blaine Higgs is accusing CUPE of dragging its feet in that process and will legislate an end to it.

"We need to move forward with a New Brunswick pension solution for our employees," Higgs told reporters.

"Legislation was not the route we wanted to go but unfortunately negotiations have not resulted in any workable plan."

An older man in a suit talking with microphones pointed at him 'Legislation was not the route we wanted to go but unfortunately negotiations have not resulted in any workable plan,' says Premier Blaine Higgs. (Ed Hunter/CBC)

Union officials accused Higgs of effectively tearing up their existing contracts with the bill introduced Wednesday.

Some CUPE members ripped out pages of their collective agreement Wednesday morning and tossed them into a fire in a metal barrel on the front lawn of the Legislature.

"It's a pension issue, but moreso, it's a breaking of a free, collective agreement, signed document. That's the big issue," said Theresa McAllister, the provincial president of CUPE Local 2745, one of the unions affected.

She said if the premier gets away with the move, it'll set a precedent for all public-sector unions.

"This is going to have a big impact on all groups. Of course we have to push back. We have to fight back."

Asked what that will involve, McAllister and CUPE 1253 president Iris Lloyd said to "stay tuned." 

WATCH | 'We have to fight back': CUPE members burn collective agreement:
 

CUPE members burn pages of collective agreement in response to Higgs

Duration 0:58
Province introduces legislation to force two CUPE locals into a shared-risk pension plan.

Opposition Liberal MLA and labour critic Marco LeBlanc slammed the government for targeting unionized workers just six sitting days before the legislature is scheduled to adjourn for the Christmas break.

"They're forcing them, through legislation, to accept things that they should be at the negotiating table negotiating, not in this house," he said.

The two CUPE locals represent about 7,200 school custodians, maintenance workers, bus drivers and administrative staff.

Three groups of nursing home employees coming under the New Brunswick Council of Nursing Home Unions are also covered by the legislation.

A man with glasses smiles in front of artwork on the wall behind him. 'They’re forcing them, through legislation, to accept things that they should be at the negotiating table negotiating, not in this House,' says Opposition Liberal MLA and labour critic Marco Leblanc. (Serge Bouchard/Radio-Canada)

In 2021 Higgs wanted the two school unions to agree to a shared-risk pension plan like the one he crafted for large parts of the public sector in 2014, when he was finance minister. 

To end the 16-day strike by several CUPE locals, they struck a side agreement that envisioned negotiations and, failing an agreement, the use of third-party actuaries to settle the pension issue. 

Higgs said the unions failed to live up to that.

"We saw no light in that tunnel for that to happen," he said.

But McAllister and Lloyd said the side deal allowed for the extension of timelines, something the province itself used before deciding this fall to adopt legislation.

While rejecting the idea that he was breaking the contract, Higgs could not explain how the existing collective agreement allows for this move.

Instead he repeated that the union hasn't respected the timeline in the 2021 side agreement.

Two women stand outside in winter coats amid people carrying union signs.   Iris Lloyd, left, president of CUPE local 1253 and Theresa McAllister, president of CUPE local 2745, say the side deal allowed for the extension of timelines, something the province itself used before deciding this fall to adopt legislation. (Jacques Poitras/CBC)

The legislation also explicitly immunizes the province from a legal challenge. 

The three nursing home groups weren't part of the 2021 side deal on a process but were apparently added to the bill on Tuesday, according to Sharon Teare, president of the New Brunswick Council of Nursing Home Unions. 

"Until this morning, there was no notice that we would be included in that," said Teare.

She said existing nursing home contracts already have language on resolving pension issues.

"I don't understand how he can just arbitrarily change legislation and take those collective agreements and disrespect them and the process." 

Woman with chin-length brown hair and glasses wearing red CUPE T-shirt stands amid people carrying union signs outside legislative building.     'I don't understand how [Higgs] can just arbitrarily change legislation and take those collective agreements and disrespect them and the process,' says Sharon Teare, president of the N.B. Council of Nursing Home Unions. (Jacques Poitras/CBC)

The legislation would set out a deadline for negotiations to lead to a memorandum of understanding in which CUPE would choose one of three shared-risk plans to join. 

The next step would be a "transfer agreement" between administrators the old and new plans to start the transition in February 2024.

According to the bill, if the two sides can't agree, an arbitrator can step in and impose a resolution.

Higgs said that's not unlike what was contemplated in the side agreement with CUPE, except now there's a firm deadline for an imposed solution. 

The shared-risk system links the performance of pension funds to the market and relieves the government and taxpayers of the risk of having to make up pension shortfalls, as it must do in defined-benefit plans.

The five affected locals have shortfalls totalling $285 million, the province says. CUPE has accused the government of creating that gap by starving the funds of required contributions.

The legal expert hired by the province to oversee this move says the shared-risk model has performed well for the employees who joined it almost a decade ago.

"The results have been very good for the members and we anticipate the results to be very good for these members as well," said Halifax lawyer Hugh Wright.

Two women wearing winter clothing stand outside amid people carrying union signs.  'It's a pension issue, but moreso, it's a breaking of a free, collective agreement, signed document,' says McAllister. 'That's the big issue.' (Jacques Poitras/CBC)

The province says retirees already in the shared-risk system have seen a 23.27 per cent cost of living adjustment to their pensions over the last decade, compared to increases of 16 to 20 per cent for those in the five bargaining units not in the system.

Higgs said the government presented a proposal to CUPE in February and heard nothing from them until September,  when the union proposed putting the pensions in an Ontario-based plan that he said would cost the province $1 billion.

In contrast, shifting the pensions to a shared-risk system would cost much less: about $365 million, according to the province. 

ABOUT THE AUTHOR


Jacques Poitras

Provincial Affairs reporter

Jacques Poitras has been CBC's provincial affairs reporter in New Brunswick since 2000. He grew up in Moncton and covered Parliament in Ottawa for the New Brunswick Telegraph-Journal. He has reported on every New Brunswick election since 1995 and won awards from the Radio Television Digital News Association, the National Newspaper Awards and Amnesty International. He is also the author of five non-fiction books about New Brunswick politics and history.

 
 
 
202 Comments
 
 
 
David Amos 
Surprise Surprise Surprise
 
 
 
David Amos

What a difference a day makes eh?

Big banks announce layoffs and more bad loans as TD, Royal and CIBC post quarterly results

TD, CIBC eliminate thousands of jobs; RBC, Scotia previously announced similar layoffs

Pete Evans · CBC News · Posted: Nov 30, 2023 10:35 AM AST

 
David Amos    

Reply to David Amos
Perhaps somebody should check my work from 20 years ago
Full Committee Hearing
Review of Current Investigations and Regulatory Actions Regarding the Mutual Fund Industry
Date:   Thursday, November 20, 2003 
 
 
 
David Amos
"The legal expert hired by the province to oversee this move says the shared-risk model has performed well for the employees who joined it almost a decade ago.

"The results have been very good for the members and we anticipate the results to be very good for these members as well," said Halifax lawyer Hugh The legal expert hired by the province to oversee this move says the shared-risk model has performed well for the employees who joined it almost a decade ago.

"The results have been very good for the members and we anticipate the results to be very good for these members as well," said Halifax lawyer Hugh Wright.The legal expert hired by the province to oversee this move says the shared-risk model has performed well for the employees who joined it almost a decade ago.

"The results have been very good for the members and we anticipate the results to be very good for these members as well," said Halifax lawyer Hugh Wright.."

I wonder if Higgy told Mr Wright what I thought of actuaries back in 2013

Higgs faces angry retirees over pension changes

Apologizes for lack of consultation on proposed shared-risk model

Robert Jones · CBC News · Posted: Apr 17, 2013 7:07 PM ADT

"New Brunswick Finance Minister Blaine Higgs apologized to a roomful of angry retirees in Saint John on Wednesday, acknowledging government has not properly consulted them over pension plan changes.

"We messed up in the communication," said Higgs. "So we're trying to fix that."

"But a government actuary at the Saint John meeting acknowledged cost of living increases will be eliminated for pensioners and instead be dependent upon market performance. Higgs did not disagree with the angry crowd, saying government communication of pension changes "left a lot to be desired."

 
David Amos    
Reply to David Amos  
Go Figure

The pension downside of living longer

CBC News · Posted: Aug 06, 2013 4:32 PM ADT

Canadians are living longer than ever before. Most of us would consider that good news. But longer lives could pose new funding risks for many pension plans and their members.

The Canadian Institute of Actuaries has just released a new draft set of mortality tables that suggests that the average Canadian woman at age 60 can now look forward to another 29.4 years of life — an increase of 2.7 years over the old mortality tables. The average 60-year-old man can now expect an additional 2.9 years of life — up to an extra 27.3 years.

According to Towers Watson, a major pension consulting firm, that creates a potential problem for the sponsors of defined benefit pension plans, which guarantee predetermined pension benefits for their members.

If their plan members are now living longer, as the new mortality study suggests, then pension accounting liabilities could grow, forcing existing members to come up with larger pension contributions.

Towers Watson estimates that if the proposed new mortality tables are widely adopted, pension accounting liabilities for many plans could jump "immediately' by five to 10 per cent.

"This study highlights the risk that increasing life expectancy can pose for [defined benefit] plan sponsors," said Gavin Benjamin, a senior retirement consultant at Towers Watson.

 
David Amos    
Reply to David Amos
"Just as sponsors were beginning to see a reduction in their pension deficits due to improvements in the global equity markets and rising interest rates this year, the increase in life expectancy suggested by the [Canadian Institute of Actuaries] study could reverse much of this gain."

Defined contribution plans also affected

It's not just defined benefit plans that are affected by longer lifespans, Towers Watson warns. Employees who are members of defined contribution (DC) pension plans may need to save more or work longer if they expect to live an extra two or three years more.

Life annuity payouts, for instance, depend on prevailing long-term interest rates, age, gender, as well as longevity expectations. Longer expected lives mean a smaller monthly payout, all other things being equal.

The actuarial study also found that workers in the public sector generally enjoyed a higher overall life expectancy than workers in the private sector.

"While this may be good news for public sector employees and pensioners who are largely covered by [defined benefit] plans, there will be financial implications to consider," said Benjamin.

 
 
 
Wilbur Ross   
MLAs will never give up THEIR defined benefit pensions because they are better than risk-share pensions. Custodians and Bus Drivers work hard for a small pension and all Higgs wants to do is cut into what little we've earned. No wonder we can't find anyone to work in the schools anymore. Now you need to work two and three jobs just to make ends meet. Service workers can't get ahead anywhere, even working for the government means nothing these days. We are all treated the same weather we are at our second jobs at Walmart or Sobeys or the School Board ... given just enough to get by.
 
 
David Amos    
Reply to Wilbur Ross  
Deja Vu???

Saint John pension reform fix pitched by consultant

City's pension deficit is actually $342M, says Susan Rowland

CBC News · Posted: Nov 27, 2012 7:25 AM AST

"She said the Saint John plan is the victim of a perfect storm — retirees living far longer than expected, low investment returns, and new rules which make it mandatory to prepare for even lower investment returns in future.

Rowland also said the actual pension plan deficit is much higher than Saint John residents may believe.

The official pension deficit stands at $195-million, but Rowland said the more accurate figure would be $342 million.

Rowland said the city has two options, either to convert the pension to a defined contribution plan or adopt a shared-risk model.

The consultant is advocating a shared-risk pension plan, similar to a new model adopted by the provincial government."

"In May, the New Brunswick Union, the Canadian Union of Public Employees Local 1252 and the New Brunswick Pipe Trades said they planned to use the new pension model for some of their pension plans."  

 
Wilbur Ross
Reply to David Amos
Things are stacked against us on a good day. But we will stand firm. We have been since 2014. He's just been trying and trying to finish railroading us ... but he's failed at every attempt. I think the public can see what he's doing. And all the other Unions see what's going on ... this ain't Irving bub. Without a doubt any agreement with this weasel ain't worth a sack of soggy ...
 
 
 
Wilbur Ross   
And they immunize themselves from a legal challenge like an GD' cherry on top. Vile Tories doing what they do a Christmas.
 
 
David Amos    
Reply to Wilbur Ross   
Go Figure 
 
 
 
HenryjD Gondorff 
New Brunswick MLAs to get pay raise in 2024

Global News

June 5, 2023

Ministers will continue to receive a top-up of $52,614, but the premier’s extra pay will be the same amount as the base salary. That means the top job will pay $186,256 per year. The current salary of Premier Blaine Higgs is $152,150.

 
David Amos    
Reply to HenryjD Gondorff  
Methinks Higgy and his cohorts are gonna have a Merry Yuletide Season N'esy Pas? 
 
 
Deborah Reddon 
Reply to HenryjD Gondorff  
There are so many unnecessary MLA's in New Brunswick. The number of constituents they look after is so small they could hand write Christmas cards to each one. Yet, my MLA in Fredericton was unable to speak with me because he was in New York and then Toronto on "business". He never did return my call 
 
 
marc lapointe
Reply to David Amos
Methinks U R write NESSY PAW....at it again ? 



 
David Wilson   
You can not break terms of a collective agreement because you previously negotiated something you are no longer happy with.
 
 
David Amos    
Reply to David Wilson  
Good luck explaining that to Higgy et al
 
 
 
David Wilson 
Higgs does not have a legal foot to stand on. 
 
 
Don Corey   
Reply to David Wilson
Are you a labour lawyer or just a pandemic expert?
 
 
David Amos    
Reply to Don Corey
Good question 
 
 
 
Terri Baxter   
These whiners are just jealous they don't have a pension plan. People in these unions are also tax payers in this province. Contributions which are deducted from each and every pay cheque are large. So it's far from a free ride to collect a pension when you reach retirement, and if you reach retirement. CPP may not even be around in a few year. And we all pay into that on top. Some people need to give their closed minds a good shake.
 
 
David Amos    
Reply to Terri Baxter 
You attack my precious CPP???

Give your closed mind a good shake.

 
 
Frank Brace
Higgs exercising parental rights to take pension funds, reduce pay and break contracts .
 
 
Don Corey   
Reply to Frank Brace
Where is there any mention of "taking pension funds"? Did you actually read the article?
 
 
Frank Brace
Reply to Don Corey
Defined benefit reduced to defined contribution is a reduction in security, and benefits and a pass for the administrator , but you have to understand forced changes and pensions to appreciate that 
 
 
David Amos    
Reply to Frank Brace
Check my work 
 
 
 
Archie MacDaniel
These unions already embarrassed themselves enough when the strike happened, now they are doing it again. Unions need to be dismantled.


Frank Brace
Reply to Archie MacDaniel
The old anti-worker working people have no rights 
 
 
Don Corey   
Reply to Archie MacDaniel
Dream on..... 
 
 
Wilbur Ross 
Reply to Archie MacDaniel
Go for it. YOU are super weak. 
 
 
David Amos    
Reply to Don Corey
Ditto
 
 
 
Don Corey
All private sector workers in NB would love to have a shared risk pension plan comparable to the one now provided to many NB public sector unions. The plans are still defined benefit in nature as far as the method used to determine pension benefits. These plans are also very costly to taxpayers, but, when plan funding shortfalls occur, the risk is shared 50/50 between the employer (government) and plan participants.

Poitras' comment "The shared-risk system links the performance of pension funds to the market and relieves the government and taxpayers of the risk of having to make up pension shortfalls, as it must do in defined-benefit plans" is incorrect. It makes no mention (probably deliberately) of the 50/50, which is precisely why these plans are called shared risk.

Don't feel too sorry for these government employees.

And the burden on NB taxpayers is definitely reduced.

 
Art McCarthy 
Reply to Don Corey 
You must be a fisher; presenting so many red herrings. The public service pension plan is not taxpayer-funded. The payouts are made from the investments made and managed by Vestcor, a crown corp established specifically and singularly for that purpose. That fund is HUGE. Barring a catastrophic market fall there is no risk of a fund short-fall. 
 
 
MR Cain 
Reply to Art McCarthy   
"While Vestcor is not a Crown Corporation, they are responsible for handling the pension fund for Government of New Brunswick employees and therefore need to be held accountable," Rob McKee, the Liberal finance and treasury board critic, said in a statement https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/record-bonuses-modest-investment-1.6495497
 
 
MR Cain 
Reply to MR Cain
It was originally a Crown agency but was reconfigured, renamed and given its independence in 2016. 
 
 
Don Corey
Reply to Art McCarthy
Well, I do enjoy trout fishing a few times each summer, and the odd salmon fishing trip on Crown reserve.

As to public sector pension plans in NB, Vestor manages the funds, absolutely. But you neglect to mention that plan funding comes from employees and the government. So who do you think provides the government portion of the funding?

As to fund shortfalls, they most certainly do occur (market downturns and interest rate fluctuations are the most obvious reasons) regardless of the amount of money being managed. Keep in mind there are also always significant withdrawals to meet pensioner obligations.

Your knowledge of pension plans appears to be minimal at best. Perhaps you should stick to seafood.

 
Wilbur Ross 
Reply to Don Corey
Apply for a job then. We are always hiring and we need people. You have no clue at all.
 
 
David Amos    
Reply to Don Corey
Well put
 
 
David Amos    
Reply to Wilbur Ross  
I gave you lots of clues
 
 
David Amos    

Reply to Art McCarthy
"That fund is HUGE. Barring a catastrophic market fall there is no risk of a fund short-fall."

Remember Victor Boudreau's budget? Methinks the next market nosedive will far worse N'esy Pas?

N.B. government heading for $800M deficit, civil service cuts: official

Tory MLA, observers question release of budget information

CBC News · Posted: Mar 11, 2009 5:46 AM ADT

The New Brunswick government is in line for a massive $800-million deficit in 2009-10 and is planning a series of program cuts and significant reductions in the civil service, a government official confirmed Tuesday night.

When Finance Minister Victor Boudreau tables his budget March 17, the official said, it will include a large deficit, more than one-third of which will be blamed on losses incurred by provincial pension plans on the stock markets.

 
Don Corey
Reply to Wilbur Ross 
Speaking of having no clue..... 
 
 
Don Corey
Reply to David Amos
Good luck with any of them sinking in.  
 
 
 
 
Dennis Atchison
While is seems a complex topic, at its root this is very simple. I was part of the original study and work on Pension Reform for NB, and we offered the Dutch Model as an example to follow. At that time, the public pension plans in Canada were one of the best in the world, and copied by many (i.e. the Plans were not "in trouble"). Nonetheless, then Finance Minister Higgs implemented something they titled the "Shared Risk Plan" (though the math demonstrated there was no sharing of the risk, as it was all deferred to the pensioners). Key element in the sales pitch to "shared risk" was this plan would make pensions for ALL citizens possible ... and the expectation was the private sector would return to the days when they offered pension coverage as part of their recruitment and retention strategy. Clearly, that has not happened. The Pension Coalition did their best to argue in the courts (as government had turned a deaf ear to their own employees) but the government simply outlasted and out spent the Coalition's best efforts. Now this story ... again presented as a "solution" when in its origins there never was a "problem". If you don't accept this, just go to The Dennis Report and the interview with Cyril Theriault and Brian Durelle - two experts in public sector pensions. 
 
 
David Amos   

Reply to Dennis Atchison
Say hey to Cyril or me will ya? 
 
 
Allan Marven  

Reply to Dennis Atchison  
 
 
Gordon Ross
Reply to Dennis Atchison   
With Higgs, it's his way or the highway. He is never to be trusted. Read the Quinn Report which came out in 2014 and you will know way.
 
 
David Amos    
Reply to Allan Marven 
Too late 
 
 
Eugene Peabody
Reply to Dennis Atchison  
Thank you for the input . Higgs is only interested in helping the people who already have lots of money keep making more.  
 
 
David Amos    
Reply to Gordon Ross
Amen
 
 
David Amos    

Reply to Dennis Atchison 
Just more of the same old same old. I trust that Higgy knows many times have I run against all the political parties EH Mr Former Wannabe Leader?

New Brunswick NDP meet to elect new leader

CBC News · Posted: Oct 12, 2007 1:58 PM ADT

"The province's NDP will pick a new leader this weekend in Moncton and begin the process of rebuilding the party after dismal election results in 2006.

Communications specialist Dennis Atchison, 51, and former Catholic priest Roger Duguay, 44, will have their names on the ballot. Both men ran unsuccessfully in last year's provincial election.

Allison Brewer stepped down as leader when the party garnered just five per cent of the popular vote in the election. She said she couldn't continue in an unpaid position after the party didn't earn any seats in the legislature."

"Both of the candidates have a strong background in communicating with the public, said interim leader Pat Hanratty.

"They realize that communication is vital, and also that the party does, and that they're going to have to step up the leader's schedule," Hanratty said.

According to the leadership candidate Atchison, the NDP needs to overcome internal resistance to trying new things and use the next three years to show voters that the party is a viable political option."

 
David Amos    

Reply to Eugene Peabody  
All politicians behave the same as Higgy
 
 
 
 
David Wilson  
Typical Conservative moves.

Claim to be allied with the best interests of the common man, yet fight the labour movement tooth and nail against anything that improves lives.

 
David Webb 
Reply to David Wilson  
WWHD? What would Holt do?
 
 
Eugene Peabody 
Reply to David Webb  
If you really want to know what she would do you can talk her. I have and I was very impressed with her attitude .
 
 
David Webb 
Reply to Eugene Peabody  
Can you not share a tidbit or two, even if it is just about attitude. I keep listening but so far, other than platitudes ?????
 
 
Eugene Peabody 
Reply to David Webb  
Well her attitude towards climate change and what needs to done is completely different. She will not continue with the fuel tax gift for the Irving refinery. And housing has a bigger priority than roads.
 
 
David Amos   

Reply to David Webb 
Have you bothered to read anything I managed to post?
 
 
 
 

Higgs faces angry retirees over pension changes

Apologizes for lack of consultation on proposed shared-risk model

Higgs tries to calm pension fears

Duration 2:15
Featured VideoFinance Minister Blaine Higgs faced angry retirees in Saint John at his first information session on proposed shared-risk pension model.

New Brunswick Finance Minister Blaine Higgs apologized to a roomful of angry retirees in Saint John on Wednesday, acknowledging government has not properly consulted them over pension plan changes.

"We messed up in the communication," said Higgs. "So we're trying to fix that."

Higgs is barnstorming New Brunswick, visiting seven cities in four days to try and reassure retired civil servants the province's new shared-risk pension model will not hurt them and that the changes are necessary.

But suspicion and anger among the estimated 400 people who attended the first meeting in Saint John ran high, with several accusing the provincial government of imposing changes without consultation or negotiation of any kind.

"I do not want the government to reflect that they have consulted with us because they have not," said Deborah McCormack to a rousing ovation.

McCormack is a former health department employee who has been organizing opposition to pension changes.

Higgs faced similar hostility from the estimated 1,000 people who gathered for the information session in Fredericton on Wednesday night.

Will lose protection against inflation

Several hundred people attended the information session in Saint John on Wednesday. (Robert Jones/CBC)

Under the current plan, the risk of any market downturns is borne by the provincial government alone. Under the reforms, the risk would be shared by both sides.

The proposed model, unveiled last May by Premier David Alward, also includes increased contribution levels and higher age of retirement phased in slowly over a period of time.

Government officials have previously said the pension changes would not cut the benefits in place for retirees.

But a government actuary at the Saint John meeting acknowledged cost of living increases will be eliminated for pensioners and instead be dependent upon market performance.

Higgs did not disagree with the angry crowd, saying government communication of pension changes "left a lot to be desired."

He promised co-operation going forward, but warned financial problems with the province's various pension plans require significant changes.

The Public Service Superannuation Act (PSSA) currently has a $1 billion shortfall, which is expected to get worse with people living longer and interest rates at historically low levels, Higgs has said.

The PSSA plan covers employees who work directly for government departments and NB Power and included 13,441 pensioners as of March 31, 2012. Their average annual pension was $20,603.

In addition the PSSA has 19,611 active contributors.

The government wants to move the $4-billion PSSA plan to the shared-risk model first, followed by the teachers' $4.2-billion plan, the crowd was told.

The government hasn't had time to deal with the teachers' plan yet, officials said, to boos and cat calls.

Wants to convert 7 plans

Currently the government sponsors seven defined benefit pension plans for various employee groups, which it is hoping to transform into less expensive shared-risk plans.

Several unions that belonged to cheaper defined contribution pension plans signed onto the reform right away, but the province is now moving to force others in as well.

Combined, the seven defined benefit plans cover nearly 57,000 current and former government employees, a group that represents 11 per cent of the entire voting age population in the province.

Higgs listened to a litany of complaints about a lack of information from government about what the changes will mean and attempts to portray pensioners as spoiled and privileged.

"I find it especially distasteful having been someone who earned my pension in Fredericton to be referred to as a whiner by someone who speaks on behalf of government," said retiree Sharon MacFarlane, a former vice-president of finance at NB Power.

"As a government employee, we take part of our compensation now and we take part of it later. That's the deal."

Meetings will also be held in:

  • Moncton, April 18, 1 p.m.-3 p.m., Moncton Lions Club, 55 Mark Ave.
  • Miramichi, April 18, 6 p.m.-8 p.m., New Brunswick Community College gymnasium, 80 University Ave.
  • Bathurst, April 19, 1 p.m.-3 p.m., Collège communautaire du Nouveau-Brunswick amphitheatre, Room 286C, 75 Youghall Dr.
  • Campbellton, April 19, 6 p.m.-8 p.m.: Collège communautaire du Nouveau-Brunswick gymnasium, 47 du Village Ave.
  • Edmundston, April 20, 1 p.m.-3 p.m.: Clarion Hotel, Banquet Room, 100 Rice St.

 

ABOUT THE AUTHOR


Robert Jones

Reporter

Robert Jones has been a reporter and producer with CBC New Brunswick since 1990. His investigative reports on petroleum pricing in New Brunswick won several regional and national awards and led to the adoption of price regulation in 2006.

 
 
 

Saint John pension reform fix pitched by consultant

City's pension deficit is actually $342M, says Susan Rowland

Saint John pension reform

Duration 1:40
Featured VideoSaint John councillors were told they could cut their pension payments by $10 million a year by switching to a shared-risk model

Saint John council could cut its pension payments by $10 million a year by switching to a shared-risk plan, a consultant told the city on Monday night.

Susan Rowland, the chairperson of a pension task force that has been reviewing the city’s beleaguered pension plan, offered a blunt assessment of Saint John’s situation at a council meeting on Monday.

"This is the worst pension plan I've ever seen," she told councillors.

"Your pension plan is not in good shape at all."

Saint John councillors listened to Susan Rowland's pension reform proposal on Monday night. (CBC)

She said the Saint John plan is the victim of a perfect storm — retirees living far longer than expected, low investment returns, and new rules which make it mandatory to prepare for even lower investment returns in future.

Rowland also said the actual pension plan deficit is much higher than Saint John residents may believe.

The official pension deficit stands at $195-million, but Rowland said the more accurate figure would be $342 million.

Rowland said the city has two options, either to convert the pension to a defined contribution plan or adopt a shared-risk model.

The consultant is advocating a shared-risk pension plan, similar to a new model adopted by the provincial government.

The proposed pension plan would share the risk for future deficits between workers and the city and opens the option to temporarily reduce benefits if the fund falls behind.

In the meantime, the city will have to pay $12 million a year for 15 years to retire the deficit.

Councillors will hear more about the proposed new plan at a special meeting on Thursday.

'Why should the taxpayers suffer this double-whammy? Have they not suffered enough and will they not suffer enough for the next 10 to 15 years?' — Coun. Susan Fullerton

Rowland’s plan may not be a foregone conclusion.

Coun. Bill Farren said he is going to take some time to consult with others before he decides whether he will endorse the proposal.

Coun. Susan Fullerton, who has said in the past she would like to examine offering city employees a RRSP or defined contribution plan, also sounded critical on Monday.

"Why should the taxpayers suffer this double-whammy? Have they not suffered enough and will they not suffer enough for the next 10 to 15 years?" she said.

The provincial legislature passed a bill before it adjourned for the summer that repealed the Saint John Pension Act. That move gave Saint John greater autonomy in handling its pension crisis.

With that new power over its pension plan, Saint John councillors requested Rowland lead a task force that would recommend a solution to the woes facing the city's pension plan.

Rowland was involved with a similar pension task force that recommended a shared-risk model for the provincial government.

When the provincial model was announced, Premier David Alward said these reforms would not cut the benefits that are in place for retirees but it will likely lead to "marginal" increases to employee contributions.

Other changes include, basing pensions on an "enhanced career average" of earnings rather than the employee’s final salary.

Further, the retirement age will be moved to 65 from 60 over a 40-year period.

In May, the New Brunswick Union, the Canadian Union of Public Employees Local 1252 and the New Brunswick Pipe Trades said they planned to use the new pension model for some of their pension plans.

 
 
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/fredericton-approves-shared-risk-pension-plan-1.1385857

Fredericton approves shared-risk pension plan

Capital city's old pension system has a $60M deficit

Fredericton approves pension reform

Duration 1:43
Featured VideoFredericton council unanimously approved a new shared-risk pension plan on Monday night

Fredericton councillors unanimously approved a plan on Monday to convert the city’s pension plan to a shared-risk model, which has been promoted by the provincial government.

Councillors held a special meeting on Monday to discuss the move to a shared-risk pension plan. Saint John switched its troubled pension plan to a shared-risk system on Jan. 1.

The move to a shared-risk plan will mean city employees will have to work longer with fewer guarantees.

The move also means changes to the cost-of-living adjustment for city pensioners.

Fredericton's current pension plan was in a $60-million deficit.

Andrew Dawson said the police union has filed a motion to the Labour and Employment Board in an effort to slow down the pension reforms. (CBC)

Unions representing the city’s police officers and firefighters still remain holdouts to the new pension deal.

Andrew Dawson, a representative for Local 911, which represents the police union, said people need time to process all of the information.

The police union has turned to the province's Labour and Employment Board in search of a way to stop the switch.

The board will hear the police association's complaint on Wednesday.

Wade Keirstead, who represents the union for technical and professional employees, said his group signed onto the reforms but he said it wasn't an easy decision.

"The biggest impact is the loss of early retirement... We say early retirement, people would still have 35 years into their career but it’s certainly not something that people are looking forward to," he said.

Whether the unions agree with the reforms, the city has moved forward with the changes.

O’Brien said he would like all of the city’s unions to back the pension reform.

"They are now part of the plan. But we would certainly like them as a willing partner," he said.

Pension reform

Premier David Alward unveiled a shared-risk plan for provincial government employees last May and has been talking about the merits of other organizations adopting the scheme.

Under the plan, the age of retirement will be moved to 65 from 60 over a 40-year period, contribution levels will increase and cost-of-living increases will be conditional on the plan's performance.

Susan Rowland, the chairperson of the provincial pension task force, has said she believes all municipalities should join a province-wide, shared-risk pension plan.

It would protect pensions for workers and offer stability to employers by cutting administrative costs and offering better investment opportunities, she has said.

There are already 44 medium and small New Brunswick municipalities sharing a single pension plan.

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