5 takeaways from hearings on mandatory vaccinations
---------- Original message ---------- From: Ginette.PetitpasTaylor@parl.gc.ca Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2018 19:08:54 +0000 Subject: RE: Methinks I should remind the local Health Minister Benoît Bourque while he still
has the job that I still don't have my Health Care Card YET N'esy Pas Ginette Petitpas Taylor? To: motomaniac333@gmail.com
Dear Mr. Amos,
On behalf of the Honourable Ginette Petitpas Taylor, I would like to acknowledge receipt of your correspondence and I thank you for writing.
The Member welcomes the views of her constituents on the issues that are important to them, whether supportive or critical.
You may rest assured that your comments and suggestions have been duly noted and are appreciated.
Once again, thank you for taking the time to write.
Patti Trites Executive Assistant/Adjointe exécutive The Hon./l’hon. Ginette Petitpas Taylor, P.C./c.p. Member of Parliament/députée Moncton-Riverview-Dieppe Constituency Office/Bureau de circonscription 272 rue St. George St., Suite 110 Moncton, NB E1C 1W6 Tel/Tél: (506) 851-4987 Fax/Téléc.: (506) 851-3273
David Raymond Amos @DavidRayAmos Replying to @DavidRayAmos @Kathryn98967631 and 49 others
Methinks I should remind the local Health Minister Benoît Bourque while he still has the job that I still don't have my Health Care Card YET N'esy Pas Ginette Petitpas Taylor?
Bilingual ambulance service dominates 1st question period of new legislature
Majority of Ambulance New Brunswick job openings are for bilingual positions
Jacques Poitras · CBC News · Posted: Oct 24, 2018 5:27 PM AT
69 Comments
David Amos Methinks I should remind the Health Minister Benoît Bourque while he still has the job that I still don't have my Health Care Card YET N'esy Pas?
5 takeaways from hearings on mandatory vaccinations
384 Comments Commenting is now closed for this story.
David Amos
Content disabled
Oh My My
"Anderson-Mason could not be reached for comment Tuesday."
Methinks silence from the Attorney General and Chair of the Committee
should speak volumes to Cardy about his Bill and his future as a
Minister N'esy Pas?
David Amos
Content disabled
Methinks if Higgs hopes to have a chance at winning the next election he would dump the former NDP Leader ASAP N'esy Pas?
"Midway through the third and final day of testimony, Anderson-Mason, a
member of the cabinet, wouldn't commit to voting for the bill.
"I can't say that I've reached a conclusion until I've heard all the evidence," she told reporters.
That prompted Cardy to tell Radio-Canada that in our Westminster model
of cabinet government, "if you can't support a government, you have to
resign." He said Premier Blaine Higgs is committed to the bill.
Anderson-Mason could not be reached for comment Tuesday."
David Amos Methinks
in the spirit of full disclosure i should admit that I had given up on
Vaccine Choice Canada until I got a call the warmed my heart last night
and I have no doubt that the Feds know all about it N'esy Pas?
Ted Kuntz Two
points this article neglected to address. The MLAs on the committee
WERE persuaded by expert testimony. Medical doctors, vaccine safety
researchers, and a constitutional lawyer presented verifiable evidence
that vaccines can cause injuries and death. And, we live in a society
where there is risk, there must be choice. Second, Vaccine Choice
Canada, and the parents of vaccine injured children who presented at the
hearings are not "anti-vaccine" as purported. This is purposeful
deception and distortion by both Minister Cardy and the mainstream
media. Every single presenter was very clear, they are "anti-vaccine
MANDATES". To describe this movement as "anti-vaccine" is dishonest,
disrespectful, and destructive to encouraging thoughtful discussion on
the impact of removing informed consent, eliminating medical decision
making by parents, and denying bodily sovereignty. If Cardy and the
media were honest, we would be having a very different conversation in
our kitchens and living rooms. We would be asking if the risk of measles
is so great (11 cases in 2019/an undisclosed number from the vaccine
itself/no permanent injuries or deaths) that we are willing to give up
our rights and freedoms as citizens of Canada and impose a complex
medical procedure by force upon our healthy children.
David Amos
Reply to @Ted Kuntz: Methinks you and I should talk ASAP N'esy Pas?
Mack Leigh
Reply to @Ted Kuntz:
Totally agree !
Bob Smith
Reply to @Ted Kuntz:
Ahhh, the anti-vaxxer passive aggressive message. We have evidence, they
claim. The evidence? Well, vaccines are not 1000% safe so therefore
they can cause injury/death always. As for measles outbreaks, there were
two in the New Brunswick area...and more elsewhere where other anti
vaxxers peddle half truths. Oh, and top it off with "rights and
freedoms" stance to make it clear they care about their children. Maybe
the government needed to bring pictures of children stricken by polio
and smallpox to counter this "vaccines are bad" message.
David Amos
Reply to @Ted Kuntz: I just left a message on what I believe to be your voicemail machine
Steve Burke
Reply to @Bob Smith:
how many of the measles cases were fully vaccinated and why did the
Chief Medical Officer of NB decline to share that info? Why couldn’t the
answer other questions about vaccine safety? Why is Canada the only G7
country that doesn’t compensate vaccine injuries?
Mark Tyson According
to the anti common sense crowd all vaccines are bad for you . Think
about that for a second .A bunch of ordinary people with no knowledge
or backgrounds in medicine keep telling the rest of us that 'they' know
more about scientific matters than the people who are actually schooled
in the matter !
That's
like saying you know more about putting a bridge up than structural
engineers or even worse some of the naysayers actually believe that just
eating good quality food will prevent the flu or any other viral
disease from happening ! Try and get your head around that for a second.
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @Mark Tyson: But they love anecdotal "evidence"..
Serge Ibak
Reply to @Mark Tyson:
I know right. It's ridiculous. It's comparable to following the
recommended schedule on health Canada's site (which mimics the CDC in
case you're wondering) and getting the recommended 140 vaccines as told
to do so. Some people just need to give their head a shake.
It's beyond me why anyone would think eating good quality food, being
sanitary, working out, not smoking etc would have a better impact than
140 shots.
Graham McCormack
Reply to @Serge Ibak:
Curious as to where you are finding a recommendation for 140 vaccines
on Health Canada's website. Can you point the way?
Mac Isaac
Reply to @Serge Ibak:
The problem with your snide comment is that not everybody can get or
eat "good quality food, being sanitary, working out, not smoking, etc",
BUT everybody can get vaccinated!!
1st link is for kids, 2nd is for adults. I've put this into a
spreadsheet. I was given 23 vaccines...it's now a recommended list of
140. A few more in the mill. Note: this is actual vaccines, not shots
since some are now multi dose.
Serge Ibak
Reply to @Mac Isaac:
Apologies for hurting your feelings. Sometimes the truth hurts. Please
continue to vaccinate accordingly, and I will pick and choose.
Your allergies, colds, flu, rashes, eczema, illnesses can all be chalked off to coincidences or genetics.
David Amos
Content disabled
Reply to @Mac Isaac: Methinks he is not the only soul makes "snide" comments N'esy Pas?
David Amos
Reply to @David Amos: More proof of the pudding
David Amos
Reply to @Serge Ibak:
Methinks Cardy and all the other politicians and their lawyers know is
the last thing I would do is apologize for saying what I truly think
That is why I was illegally barred from parliamentary properties in 2004
while running in the election of the 38th Parliament and the ex RCMP
dude Kevin Vickers certainly can never deny it under oath N'esy Pas?
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: You side loves to ignore statistics.
Jan Toffe
Reply to @Serge Ibak:
I totally agree with you. In 1983 there was only 7 vaccines, they
have more than doubled the amount of vaccines since then. When is there
too many? I am boggled by the fact that every one knows prescription
drugs kill over 100,000 Americans a year, yet think vaccines are totally
harmless, something that is injected into small kids over and over and
over again.
Aluminum, neomycin, phenol, polysorbat 80, MRC-5 cell lines- human DNA
fragments. There is no tracking of long term harm, how much does this
contribute to the fact that 40% of our kids have at least one chronic
health condition? Asthma, allergies, neuro-developmental disorders and
more.
I say we go back to the original 7 vaccines and delay or skip the rest
until they improve the vaccines. That is not going to happen if there
mandatory, why would pharma spend the money fixing them if there
mandatory, you have to take them.
Graham McCormack
Reply to @Serge Ibak:
First link I count 31 but some of them are second and third doses of
the same vaccine and 7 on the second link.
David Amos
Content disabled
Reply to @Mac Isaac: "Snide comment"
Hmmmm
Shawn McShane
Reply to @Graham McCormack: Wow when I was a kid we got 4 or 5.
Serge Ibak
Reply to @Graham
McCormack: Let's use the Dtap as an example. It's a 5 in 1, given 4X
before 18 months. So there would be 20 before 18 mths just for Dtap.
MMRV would be 4 in 1, given twice before 18 mths...so add another 8.
Total is at 28 before 18 months....and just keep going down the list .
Graham McCormack
Reply to @Serge Ibak:
You are changing your story. MMRV is made up of 4 vaccines and given in
multiple shots, 28 as you say. That is still just 4 vaccines.
Graham McCormack
Reply to @Shawn McShane: You were given 4 or 5 shots but each contained multiple vaccines.
David Amos
Reply to @Mac Isaac: Hmmm
Serge Ibak
Reply to @Graham McCormack: shots vs vaccines...who's counting right?
Steve Burke
Reply to @Mark Tyson: a giant mess of logical fallacies there, congrats!
Steve Burke
Reply to @Mac Isaac:
wrong, not everyone can get vaccinated. not everyone can take aspirin
either but they’re not called anti-aspirin for pointing that out. Look
up “contraindications” in the dictionary
Tim Biddiscombe I have the flu ..it must have been the polio vaccination I got.
David Amos
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: Methinks its time for your nap N'esy Pas?
Shawn McShane
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: Could have been the flu vaccine...
-CBC Flu shot linked to higher incidence of flu in pandemic year
Miss Daisy
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: good thing u didnt get polio
David Amos Too Too Funny Indeed
"Midway through the third and final day of testimony, Anderson-Mason, a
member of the cabinet, wouldn't commit to voting for the bill.
"I can't say that I've reached a conclusion until I've heard all the evidence," she told reporters.
That prompted Cardy to tell Radio-Canada that in our Westminster model
of cabinet government, "if you can't support a government, you have to
resign." He said Premier Blaine Higgs is committed to the bill.
Anderson-Mason could not be reached for comment Tuesday."
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @David Amos: You lost to him, N'esy Pas?
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @David Amos: Too funny indeed ;)
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @David Amos: Can you tell us all what that has to do with vaccines pls N'esyPas?
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @David Amos: Do your political campainging elsewhere pls..
David Amos
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: Methinks a simple quote has put your knickers in quite a knot N'esy Pas?
Tim Biddiscombe I'm interested in knowing how many know a Canadian discovered the vaccine for polio that virtually wiped it off the map..
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: And then gave it away for free?
Mack Leigh
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe:
And how many know that the vaccines of today are not as safe as the
vaccines of yester year due to the amount of pollutants and toxic
chemicals they now contain ?
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @Tim
Biddiscombe: Vaccinate your kids from polio pls ..there is little risk
compared to getting the disease and suffering from that. Medical
expemptions only.
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @Mack Leigh: Only the few anti vaxxers believe that.
Serge Ibak
Reply to @Tim
Biddiscombe: labelling people really makes having a civil debate tough.
In response to your top post. Let's talk about the Oral Polio
Vaccine...surely you wouldn't have issues taking that a few times a year
would you? if we can inject health, why stop at just one vaccine...
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @Serge Ibak: I have the flu ..it must have been the polio vaccination I got.
Mark Tyson
Reply to @Mack Leigh: Show us the evidence then ! Otherwise your blowing hot air.
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: You have the flu because the flu vaccine is only 50% effective if you are lucky...
Serge Ibak
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: Get the HPV vaccine...that should fix you up...with a boost of MMR to up the immune system.
Mack Leigh
Reply to @Mark Tyson:
Example: Mercury in vaccines when dentist's are strongly recommending
that all fillings with mercury now be removed sighting health
concerns...
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @Alex Forbes: Much better than nothing..
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @Mack Leigh: The miniscule amount of mercury in vaccines is totally denatured and helps the vaccine last.
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @Serge Ibak: ad hominem Serge
tsk tsk
David Amos
Reply to @Tim
Biddiscombe:Methinks nobody cares about what you wish to know in light
of the fact that you twist everything for your buddy Cardy's benefit
N'esy Pas?
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: A couple of the few years I got the flu was when I was getting the flu vaccine.
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: Most of the pro-vaxxers are simply spewing ad hominems.
Mack Leigh
Reply to @Serge Ibak:
Yes, like the poor girl, Olympic Medalist, who just lost her life to the
same cancer that the HPV vaccine was supposed to protect her from
getting.
David Amos
Content disabled
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: Methinks you have already proven that you are a master of ad hominem comments N'esy Pas?
David Amos
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: ad hominem???
Who are you to chastise others?
David Amos
Methinks
Mr Higgs should ask his advisors to help him decide which cabinet
minister he favours his choice of Attorney General or the former NDP
Leader ASAP N'esy Pas?
Tim
Biddiscombe
Reply to @David Amos: ASAP because you said so N'esy Pas.
David Amos
Content disabled
Reply to @Tim
Biddiscombe: NOPE Methinks its a wise thing to do if his advisors have
bothered to read this article and the comments the CBC has allowed to be
published thus far N'esy Pas?
David Amos
Reply to @David Amos: Methinks I just saved more proof of the pudding N'esy Pas?
David Amos Methinks
Cardy and Northrup must have got very nervous when the lawyer brought
up the subject of Tim Hortons muffins out of the gate N'esy Pas?
"Fredericton father Andy Clark, a lawyer and entrepreneur, brought his
healthy, unvaccinated children with him when he testified. He opened
with an offer to take everyone to Tim Hortons after the kids raided a
tray of muffins set out for MLAs.
Then he invited them to weigh whether he fit Cardy's description."
Tim
Biddiscombe
Reply to @David Amos: Timbits is a good reason not to imminize your kids too..
David Amos
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: Methinks you would be a failure as a comedian best keep your job supporting Cardy N'esy Pas?
David Amos "Sussex-Fundy-St.
Martins PC MLA Bruce Northrup told Smallwood that her desire to make
her own decisions for her children "kind of explains everything."
Yea Right Methinks Northrup has never been able to explain anything he
has done as a Cabinet Minister That is why he is not one now. It should
be a small wonder why I ran against him in the last election Bruce and
his buddies Cardy et al teased me before the election Hell Cardy even
sent me a video of the clown teasing his cat "Puffin" because of my
dealings with Iceland N'esy Pas?
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @David Amos: Did you lose to him N'esy Pas?
David Amos
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: I hardy got any votes at all Whats your point?
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @David Amos: I think you just made it for me ;)
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @David Amos: But I appreciate your honesty N'esy Pas.
David Amos
Reply to @Tim
Biddiscombe: Methinks you should Google my name and that of Dominic
Cardy if you can handle the truth about your political pals N'esy Pas?
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @David Amos: Methinks I did ..and its true, you got practically no votes.
David Amos
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: Methinks you also read Cardy's note to me when he sent the Tim's Treats N'esy Pas?
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @David Amos: Wouldnt make me vote for you..n'esy pas.
Marguerite Deschamps
Reply to @David Amos: Methinks & N'esy pas. You must be quite a treat in a debate!
David Amos
Reply to @Marguerite Deschamps: Methinks anyone can Google "Fundy Royal Debate" and see for themselves N'esy Pas?
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @David Amos: I did. You got creamed l olz
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @David Amos: Nesy pas pa pa pa badoom!
David Amos
Reply to @Tim
Biddiscombe: Methinks desperate political pundits post desperate things
about past debates before another federal election N'esy Pas?
Mo Bennett apparently there have been at least 9 neanderthals visiting this article.
David Amos
Reply to @mo bennett: YO MO Are you and I within your tally?
Tim
Biddiscombe
Reply to @David Amos: N'esy pas
David Amos
Content disabled
Reply to @Tim
Biddiscombe: Methinks desperate political pundits post desperate things
while CBC blocks my comments for their benefit N'esy Pas?
David Amos
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: Methinks somebody just shot themselves in the foot while it was in their mouth N'esy Pas?
Clive Gibbons The
plural of anecdote is not evidence. The government needs to follow
today's best scientific research on this, not Sally from the internet.
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Clive Gibbons: Enough anecdotes make statistics
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @Alex Forbes: No they dont. And its not evidence either.
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @Alex Forbes: anecdotes are often ruled by emotions
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: And vaccine lobbyists have a vested interest in suppressing the side-effects.
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @Alex
Forbes: I'm not a vaccine lobbyist and I doubt there are that many side
effects that justifies putting the general public at risk.
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: If there is ANY side-effects you put public health at risk by making it mandatory.
David Amos
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: Yea Right
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @Alex
Forbes: False. Not vaccinating your kids for non medical reasons puts
those who do have valid medical reasons at risk.
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @David Amos: Nice rebuttal ;) I wonder why you failed in your election so badly N'esy Pas.
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: Wrong, that child's already weakened immune system puts them at risk.
David Amos
Reply to @Tim
Biddiscombe: Methinks you and your buddy Cardy would not dare to debate
me in public or argue me in court N'esy Pas?
Koffi Babone
Reply to @David Amos:
I'll play...What would you like to debate?
David Amos
Reply to @Koffi Babone: Public Corruption
David Amos
Reply to @Koffi
Babone: Methinks you should review Federal Court File No T-1557-15 first
in order to understand my argument N'esy Pas?
Koffi Babone
Reply to @David Amos:
I thought you wanted to discuss vaccine safety...
Sorry I have no expertise on public corruption...
FYI, it's "N'est ce pas" "N'esy pas" is not French
David Amos
Reply to @Koffi Babone: Methinks everybody in New Brunswick knows what Chiac is N'esy Pas?
Koffi Babone
Reply to @David Amos:
That's not Chiac.. My work place is 80% French (Acadian)
David Amos
Reply to @Koffi
Babone: Methinks if that is true then you have no reason to play dumb
about Cardy and public corruption. Perhaps you should say the Chiac
expression exactly like I spelled it to 80% of your bureaucratic
coworkers who work for my fellow taxpayers and see if they understood
you N'esy Pas?
David Amos
Content disabled
Reply to @Koffi
Babone: Methinks whereas you call me a liar in a public forum I must ask
is that your real name or are you just pretending to be the proverbial
bad boy and incorrigible son N'esy Pas?
David Amos
Reply to @Koffi Babone: Methinks everybody knows you are not Koffi Babone N'esy Pas?
Marguerite Deschamps
Reply to @David Amos:
I was born and bred in Chiac country and your corny expression "N'esy
Pas" does not exist. Never heard such an expression ever, except you
consistently writing it.
David Amos
Reply to @Marguerite Deschamps: PURE D BS
David Amos
Reply to @David Amos:
Methinks the next thing you will falsely claim is that legions of
liberal lawyers are not familiar with Federal Court File No T-1557-15
N'esy Pas?
MLAs struggle with how to vote on mandatory vaccination for students bill
403 Comments
Commenting is now closed for this story.
David Amos Methinks history may not review the hopefully brief Ministry of the former NDP leader in a favourable light N'esy Pas?
David Amos Methinks
i should remind Mr Cardy and his cohorts about what went down 10 years
ago between New Brunswick's vaccination expert Dr. Paul Van Buynder the
deputy chief medical officer of health and I N'esy Pas?
David Amos
Reply to @David Amos: They have their email now
David Amos "Saint
John East PC MLA Glen Savoie, who said Wednesday that the committee
process had given anti-vaccination activists too much of an unfiltered
platform, said he will vote for Cardy's legislation. "I'm in support of
the bill," he said. "It's a government bill."
Methinks Savoie wants to forget how Cardy as NDP leader tried to spoil
his second chance at his seat after the questionable liberal sudden quit
out of the gate in 2014 N'esy Pas?
David Amos "Rick
DeSaulniers of the People's Alliance, which the PC minority government
relies on for support in passing legislation, also said he was
"struggling" with how to balance what he had heard over the three days."
Methinks the ex union dude goes whichever way the wind blows for his benefit N'esy Pas?
David Amos "I've
been an MLA for 13 years and this is probably the biggest struggle I've
had, personally," he said. Northrup said he would recommend to the PC
caucus that its members be allowed a free vote on the legislation."
Yea Right Methinks Northrup forgot all the trouble he got into
supporting private woodlot owners against the Irving Clan's interests
when he was a Minister or the fact teise same woodlot owners would not
permit me to debate him during the last election. Now they are all
crying a the blues N'esy Pas?
Paul
Bourgoin This is an important New Brunswick medical decision not a Popular Political Decision!
David Amos
Reply to @Paul
Bourgoin: Methinks if Minister Cardy and his buddies, Mr Higgs and Ted
Flemming are so concerned about the health of their fellow citizens then
they would not have denied my right to Health Care merely because I run
against their political parties every chance I get N'esy Pas?
Paul
Bourgoin
Reply to @David Amos:
Funny but sad when compared to NB herbisiding programs across New
Brunswick's forest habitat with toxic herbicide impacting on human lives
and deteriorating our Children's legacy!
David Amos Surprise Surprise Surprise
"Saint John East PC MLA Glen Savoie, who said Wednesday that the
committee process had given anti-vaccination activists too much of an
unfiltered platform, said he will vote for Cardy's legislation.
"I'm in support of the bill," he said. "It's a government bill."
Jason Inness Love
Glen Savoie's reasoning for voting for this. Basically, it's because
he is told to. I hope the people of Saint John East give him the boot
he deserves. He can't come up with his own reasoning on such a
controversial bill. What the hell is he being paid for?
To me this is not a science debate, it is a rights debate. Do we as
parents not have the right to make these decisions for our children? I
wouldn't make this decision for other families, why would I expect the
government to make this decision for other families?
David Amos
Reply to @Jason Inness: I agree
Samual
Johnston Reply
to @Tim Morton: Russian roulette but with on bullet in 10 million
chambers and a good chance each time you pull the trigger you will hurt
someone else.
David Amos
Reply to @Samual Johnston: Your point is???
Samual
Johnston
Reply to @David Amos:
vaccines are for the good of society as a whole and the benefits to the
population as a whole far outweigh chance of harm to a minuscule number
of people.
David Amos
Reply to @Samual
Johnston: Methinks you are simply posting whatever crosses your mind in
support of your favourite political party latest scheme to appear noble
after they encountered fierce opposition to Cardy's plan for his beloved
"Herd" for 3 days within a very public hearing N'esy Pas?
Michael Levesque dont
struggle too much buddy, the health of taxpayers children is at stake
here. the very taxpayer that sends you a fat pay check!
Christopher
Taylor
Reply to @michael levesque:
Why threaten politicians when you don’t even pay taxes in Canada
David Amos
Reply to @Christopher
Taylor: Methinks everybody knows why Chretien deleted my SIN many moons
ago Hence I no longer have to pay income tax to the Feds N'esy Pas?
Mark Tyson To
the naysayers let me explain something. The first vaccination was
developed in "1796" thats 1796 ! Not 1953 ! It was developed when a man
noticed that milkmaids did not develop what was called the cow pox
ie:small pox . He figured out that they had their hands in cow milk and
that there was something in the milk that protected them . Today we call
it anti-bodies that exist in all living things and the rest is
history. I know this will burst a lot of brains in some quarters but
facts are facts .
Jason Inness
Reply to @Mark Tyson:
So? That doesn't mean that vaccines do not carry risks (the CDC even
says so), and it does not mean that government should be making these
decisions for our children. Government can't even run it's own affairs.
I want it out of my business as much as possible.
Christopher
Taylor
Reply to @Mark Tyson:
That’s nice. If you could add to the conversation or to the debate that would be helpful.
Bob Smith
Reply to @Christopher
Taylor: Hard to add to a conversation when anti-vaxxers close their
ears to anything they hear as not fitting their mantra.
David Amos
Reply to @Bob Smith: Methinks the same can said of the folks on your side of the fence as well N'esy Pas?
David Amos
Reply to @Mark Tyson: What does mercury protect us from?
Christopher
Taylor
Reply to @David Amos:
That’s OK. Almost all jabbers have no background in science not have
they done any substantial research beyond what they’ve gleaned from
sensational headlines, compounded by fear of the unknown and driven by
ignorance and hatred toward those who they feel don’t agree with them.
Bartholomew Palmer
Reply to @Mark Tyson:
am I missing something? What does your little historical anecdote have
to do with anything, exactly? Thank you for sharing, I guess, but
doesn't really move the needle on this discussion....
Mélissa Richard Very
happy to see some ppl are still of sound mind. That bearing was so
powerful. Those testimonies were honest, and troubling.
When we are told by pharma there is 1 in a million chance of having an
advert reaction from their vaccine, bit then you have a mother with 5
kids in front of you. 3 out of 5 have had severe complications from
their vaccine. Her younger 2 are not vaccinated. Most difficult decision
for the mother, I’m sure.
So 1 in a 100 000 000. Right. This mother has 3 for 3. What would you
call that? The worst lottery ever? And so many other mothers as well.
All testified their reactions were ignored.
Cognitive Dissonance?
Gabriel Boucher
Reply to @Mélissa Richard:
There's this thing called genetics. Might wanna check that out.
David Amos
Reply to @Mélissa Richard: Methinks Mr Boucher just answered your question about Cognitive Dissonance N'esy Pas?
David Amos
Reply to @Mélissa Richard: Did you get my voicemail?
Graham McCormack
Reply to @Mélissa Richard: Sad yes but you clearly don't understand statistics.
Samual Johnston
Reply to @Mélissa
Richard: it is really scary how you view the "facts". you would
endanger the world based on false beliefs and not facts. Don't you
doubt yourself a little when you have Amos calling you to give support?
David Amos
Reply to @Samual Johnston: Methinks you should call Cardy and tell him that he should appreciate your support N'esy Pas?
David Amos
Reply to @Samual
Johnston: BTW the lady did not return my call and methinks I should not
be surprised for obvious reasons N'esy Pas?
Alex Forbes
"Cardy
said it's vital to maintain a 95 per cent vaccination rate among
schoolchildren because that creates a "herd immunity" that prevents the
spread of diseases to a small number of children who can't be vaccinated
for legitimate medical reasons."
I have been told by several vaxxers that there is a different definition
and purpose of herd immunity which the article itself clearly doesn't
present.
David Amos
Content disabled
Reply to @Alex Forbes: Methinks Minister Cardy has read Animal Farm and taken it to heart N'esy Pas?
David Amos
Reply to @David Amos: OH My We are part of a herd
David Webb So
if one is vaccinated can they still get measles? If no, then let those
responsible, choose the risk, responsibility and cost of treatment if
and when it becomes necessary. But then they would squak that they have
a right to treatment.
Alex
Forbes
Reply to @David Webb: Hospitalization isn't necessary for the vast majority of measles cases.
Serge Ibak
Reply to @David Webb:
and what if they get the vaccine AND still get measles? t's happened Nd
will continue to happen. Who would be responsible then ?
David Amos
Reply to @Alex
Forbes: Most people my age had the measles and the mumps etc when we
were young and I don't recall any of it being any big deal
Mélissa Richard
Reply to @David Amos: Used to have measles parties, I hear. Like chicken pox parties.
Mélissa Richard
Reply to @David Webb:
Reply to @David Webb: Well, thing is, yes..... you can get sick with the
measles if you are vaccinated. In fact, the biggest outbreak in Canada
in the recent years (over a decade) was in Quebec. Patient 0 (which
means the original case) was vaccinated.
In fact, did you know there are 2 kinds of vaccine? The live vaccines can give you the disease, and spread to others.
Another fun fact: we have the technology to test which genotype strain
is involved. Wether the vaccine genotype (vaccine induced measles), or
the wild measles.
There are some stats on that too.
So now what?
Mandel Rooney Wow,
the downright ignorance of our elected officials is manifest in this
article. Lived experienc becomes part of the scientific data???
Anecdotes are not science. Fear is not science. The science shows that
vaccines save lives. No medicine is risk free, but the lives saved by
the vaccines vs the risk is monumentally one sided.
David Amos
Reply to @Mandel Rooney: So you say
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Mandel
Rooney: Anecdotal evidence in large numbers is what makes science. Good
grief you vaxxers must have tooucj aluminium in your brains
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Alex Forbes: *too much
David Amos
Content disabled
Reply to @Alex Forbes: Not funny
David Amos
Reply to @Alex Forbes: Oh my my
Mélissa Richard
Reply to @Mandel Rooney: Did you listen to the speakers at the Hearing?
Riddle me this.
Pharma said, recorded live, that the side effects of vaccines is one in a Million.
Yet here we are, in our little province, a woman testifies that 3 out of
5 of ber children have had serious consequences because of the vaccine.
The other 2, she chose not to vaccinate.
What an anecdote. One in a million, and her 3 vaccinated kids have been
injured and her whole life changes. Not just for 7 to 10 days when you
get the measles.
Fun fact: Canada declared measles no longer a threat to Canadians in
1958. Your chances of death or severe complications is about 0.1%. Your
chance at survival is 99.99%.
And your deduction is: vaccinate everybody, you’re infecting ppl and we’re gonna die...?
Lisa Penney
Reply to @Mandel
Rooney: So you would ignore all the heart attacks caused by Vioxx and
all the ligament and retinal tears in people who took Cipro?
David Amos
Reply to @Mélissa Richard: I will riddle you this
If you wish to know what Dominic Cardyu knows about me versus Big Pharma
long ago Google my name and look for an old file I called Cross Border
JJ Carrier As
a person who suffered two major diseases in the 1960s and 1970s due to
no vacs available to fight them,and almost killed me twice, I would much
rather believe a man who spoke today, who I covered as a teenager as
one of the most honest and straight-up kids ever from DRHS, than a lobby
of wahoos who got all stirred up years ago into this week's farce
because Jim Carrey's ex, that failed Playboy model, said so...Vacs save
and protect lives, while those on the other side of coin are trying to
change the debate from true facts to who can hold their breath
longer...I challenge any of these anti-vacs to public debate in any
venue, on any channel, at any time..,
Serge Ibak
Reply to @JJ Carrier:
you suffered two major illnesses....and survived. Vaccines didn't save
you, you're body did. It's a wonderful thing.
Tim Biddiscombe
Reply to @Serge Ibak: How do you know the vaccines didnt save him?
David Amos
Reply to @JJ Carrier:
Methinks everybody knows Jenny McCarthy was a successful Playboy model
Hence we should question everything else you may wish to claim N'esy
Pas?
Alex Forbes
Reply to @JJ Carrier: Almost killed you...
Serge Ibak
Reply to @Tim Biddiscombe: um because I read what he wrote. He didn't get vaccinations. They didn't exist. He lived.
David Amos
Reply to @Alex Forbes: Methinks Mother Nature decided that we needed JJ to walk among us and preach his nonsense N'esy Pas?
Jason
Inness My point on all these stories is the same: parents, not government, should be making these decisions.
But, for all of you who keep saying that immunization doesn't carry
risks, or that the "science" (that you don't know anything about) says
that there are no risks, even the Centre for Disease Control lists the
risks or various immunizations: https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vac-gen/side-effects.htm
If you scroll through them, some of these immunizations carry the risk of coma, seizures, death.
I don't think that government should be making medical decisions for
parents. I don't think that people commenting on this story can either.
This is a rights issue, not a science issue.
Samual
Johnston
Reply to @Jason
Inness: government is elected to make decisions for the greater good.
Yes there is a potential for harm but that potential is so low vs the
benefits to society and the harm to society unvaccinated people create
is so great, that it makes perfect sense that our elected officials pass
laws to make this mandatory.
JJ Carrier
Reply to @Jason Inness: Speak Canadian, not U.S.
Tim Morton
Reply to @Samual
Johnston: 12 confirmed cases of Measles. 0 deaths, 0 complications. If
we have the same vaccination rate next year, could we not expect about
the same situation if we have someone flying abroad into a Measles
outbreak area? Why all the drastic measures for 12 itchy rashes?
People will increase their vaccination rates naturally if they are
closer to Measle areas, but why force all the children to get
vaccinated? Herd Immunity needs 90% - I say a few more percentage by
willing individuals rather than forcing this.
Reply to @JJ Carrier: Are you kidding?
The CDC is a recognized authority on all things to do with, well,
diseases. They have been at this longer than their Canadian
counterparts, and it doesn't matter that they are a US agency.
Ellen
Roach
Reply to @Jason Inness: agreed! Do we want to live in a province that takes away freedom of choice from taxpayers?
CHRIS MacGillivray
Reply to @Ellen
Roach: lol, let's weigh the science against freedom of choice. Their
have been too many stories of babies and frail dying in order to
preserve paranoia, or the ability for prayer to cure all. Enough
already.
Jason Inness
Reply to @CHRIS MacGillivray:
You cannot just say science takes precedence over freedom. Further, the
science isn't conclusive. Even the CDC says there are risks associated
with immunization. That was the point of my original post above.
David Amos
Reply to @Jason Inness: I concur
Graham McCormack
Reply to @Jason Inness: There are risks associated with every medicine.
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Jason Inness: Governments always have corporations in mind.
Ellen Roach
Reply to @Graham McCormack: question
If your child has a seizure disorder
Should they get vaccinated?
David Amos
Reply to @Alex Forbes: Methinks that par for the course N'esy Pas?
Mélissa Richard
Reply to @Samual Johnston: Well now you’re talking politics. It’s called Utilitarianism. Some ppl prefer Libertarianism.
Which goes more like this; you freedoms stop where mine begin.
Either way, the great thing is the Constitution is set in place to
protect minorities. Because majority rules. That’s why we are protected
by our Rights. It just so happen, it doesn’t matter your political
position, thoughts, beliefs, perceptions, or opinions. You simply can’t
discriminate against a child and take his/her Right to free public
education.
I know, that darn pesky Constitution, eh?
Mélissa Richard
Reply to @JJ Carrier:
It just so happens vaccine injury doesn’t care about borders. CDC holds
the patents to all our vaccines.
Sorry, hope that’s not too complex for you. I mean that with respect.
Mélissa Richard
Reply to @Ellen Roach:
No Helen. Under the proposed medical exemption, i believe the child has
to either be on treatment for cancer, or have suffered several (I
believe 8) anaphylactic shock from as many different vaccines.
Even if you could be exempt, good luck finding a Dr. that will give you such a thing.
Stephen Kotyck "But
the overwhelming weight of studies by public health agencies "have
clearly indicated that vaccines are safe and effective," said Brett
Jackson, secretary-treasurer of the New Brunswick Pharmacists'
Association."
Did Brett Jackson, Secretary-treasurer of the New Brunswick Pharmacists'
Association, produce a single shred of evidence to support his claim,
or were the participants just supposed to take his word for it? We keep
hearing about "the overwhelming weight of studies by public health
agencies", but no one including public health agencies, ever produce it,
mainly because they know it does not exist. My evidence can be found
right here: https://childrenshealthdefense.org/ Do your research, what you find will shock you.
Furthermore, unless the government of New Brunswick, is prepared to
accept full and complete financial liability for life, for the children
maimed and/or killed by this mandate, I strongly suggest they back down.
They have no business inserting themselves in the personal medical
decision making process of whether or not parents choose to participate
in a high risk medical procedures for either themselves or their
children.
All vaccines carry risk, the risks are listed in the vaccine insert that
accompanies every vaccine. Many of the ingredients in vaccines have
never been tested collectively, cumulatively or in combination with
other vaccines.
As for the education minister, someone in pharma directed him to bring
this nonsense forward. That's how pharma works, who created the opiod
crisis?
Serge Ibak
Reply to @Stephen Kotyck: well said!
Samual Johnston
Reply to @Stephen
Kotyck: and no one presented any evidence against his comments. At
some point we the people rely on government to ensure the public safety
and this is one of those cases and many MLA’s are dropping the ball.
David Amos
Reply to @Serge Ibak: I agree
Mélissa Richard
Reply to @Samual
Johnston: Um. Yes. Many MLAs did, as did I when I spoke. As did the
presenter after me. Did you not listen to the Hearing? I was there for
the full 3 days.
David Amos
Reply to @Mélissa Richard: Perhaps we should talk I just left a message on what I hope was the voicemail to your office
Samual Johnston
Reply to @Mélissa
Richard: evidence as in facts....not stories. But you have Amos that
agrees with you so that is something I guess
Bartholomew Palmer
Reply to @Serge Ibak: ditto
David Amos
Reply to @Samual Johnston: Methinks you just stated a mouthful for the benefit of your buddy Mr Cardy N'esy Pas?
Michel Pelletier The
question to this, if there was a vaccin de stop de spread of
cancer, heart disease and so would still refuse to take the vaccin
Stephen Kotyck
Reply to @Michel Pelletier: You need to read up on the subject, this is as good a place as any to start:
Reply to @Stephen Kotyck: Anti-vaxxer links...I was waiting for this to pop up.
Stephen
Kotyck
Reply to @Bob Smith:
Actually Bob, links based in science, lots of science. Read them and
prove me wrong, I strongly suggest you won't be able to, but give it a
try, worst case you'll learn something new today.
Bob Smith
Reply to @Stephen
Kotyck: Links like these are based on pseudo science and false
statements...all I see is fringe folks trying to get people to expose
their children to diseases they can be safe from.
Samual Johnston
Reply to @Stephen
Kotyck: so have your read all of the information saying vaccines are a
good thing for society? Can you honestly say you disagree with it all?
This is the same as saying man never landed on the moon. Lots of
writing saying it never happened but....come on.
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Michel
Pelletier: Lifestyle is the best defense against almost all ailments
(especially lifestyle ones like cancer and heart disease)
David Amos
Reply to @Alex Forbes: True
Mélissa Richard
Reply to @Michel Pelletier:
Actually no, that’s not the question. What if vaccines can cause cancer,
autoimmune disorders, allergies, neurological issues, eczema, death,
etc..?
Are unvaccinated healthier than vaccinated children?
Emerging science is showing that yes, unvaccinated are healthier.
There are so many questions. Yours is irrelevant, sorry. I think they call that a Red Herring or a Straw-man argument.
Mélissa Richard
Reply to @Bob Smith:
Funny how the vaccine hesitant are the only ones ever to back up their
claims. And the pro vax proceed to insulting their character; yet, never
provide anything to back up there claims.
Here’s a statement, since you claim how safe vaccines are, debunk this:
There has never been ANY double-blind, placebo research on ANY of the
childhood vaccines; nor, the mix of vaccines in the current vaccine
schedule.
Here’s something else: Our babies today get 70 vaccines by the time they are 16.
Mélissa Richard
Reply to @Samual Johnston: Show me the SCIENCE that claims vaccines are good for society. I’ll wait.
Serge Ibak
Reply to @Mélissa
Richard: thank you. The debate should stop with your post. Produce the
studies, explain why the schedule is increasing at such a rapid pace
with dozens more to be added to the recommended list. Otherwise let's
take a pause.
Education minister rips into vaccine opponents as hearings open
213 Comments
Commenting is now closed for this story.
David Amos Methinks
the not so honourable Minister Cardy is well aware that he can't pass
any new laws until the next Prime Minister gets around to appointing a
new LT Governor Hence in the "mean" time this is all just hot air N'esy
Pas?
Stephen
Kotyck "Dominic
Cardy told a committee of MLAs that opponents of vaccination are
conspiracy theorists who "influence, mislead and deceive" parents into
thinking their children are at risk if they are vaccinated. "
""This is not supported in fact," Cardy said. "If you believe in
evidence-based decision-making, you have to look at the evidence, and
the evidence is incontrovertible."
Dominic Cardy, is completely ignorant of both the science and the very
real risks of vaccines. The risks are listed on the vaccine insert which
comes with every vaccine, so for him to say "the evidence is
incontrovertible", then perhaps he can share with us his
incontrovertible evidence, because it does not exist.
If he continues to insist on mandating the injection of known
neurotoxins into school age children he best be prepared to explain to
the parents how the education ministry is going to take full financial
liability for the lives the mandate ruins for children who experience
vaccine adverse events. No financial liability no mandate, which
shouldn't be a problem for him as the "evidence is incontrovertible",
right Dominic!
David Amos
Reply to @Stephen
Kotyck: Methinks folks should say hey to the questionable minister who
sent me treats in the mail before the last election Now he don't call
and don't write for obvious reasons N'esy Pas?
John Smith immunologists do not agree with the mob
David Amos
Reply to @john smith:
Speaking of the mob Google "David Amos wiretap" and you will know some
of what Cardy has known since 2004
Terrance Thomasen You go Dom. Don't even speak with the anti vaxxers or allow them a podium.
David Amos
Reply to @Terrance Thomasen: Methinks thats democracy from a conservative point of view N'esy Pas?
John Smith bill
gates polio vaccine has injured over 47000 ukraine india and africa
many pregnant and young mothers in africa will run into the woods when
who shows up in their village based on numerous deaths and injuries
John Smith
Reply to @john smith: bill gates also refuses to vaccinate his own kids
John Smith
Reply to @john smith: sorry thats just the india numbers it was more in ukraine and uncountable amount in africa
John Smith Reply to @Bob Smith: do some hard research on it i bet you change your mind
David Amos
Reply to @john smith: Methinks you should take your own advice N'esy Pas?
Marc Tremblay Chiropractics
is to medicine what Scientology is to religion. The earth is flat,
Polio and Smallpox actually helped you, and we never landed on the moon.
And autism (whatever that means in 2019 to the dismay of people who
actually suffer from the affliction) is cause by VACCINES. This must be
the other side of the story she’s talking about. Please go back to the
dark ages you time traveler you.
David Amos
Reply to @Marc Tremblay: Methinks you seem bitter about something N'esy Pas?
Ben Haroldson Quite
arr o gant, con fron tational, and a no itall, legend in his own mind
politician, that is Cardy's way. But I do support vaccination
David Amos
Reply to @Ben Haroldson: I don't as is my right
Mark Butler The
U.S. Health Resources & Services Administration (HRSA) revealed
that, since 1988, approximately $4.1 billion has been paid out in
compensation to victims of vaccine injury, If parents are forced to have
their children vaccinated, will the government give compensation? I
doubt it since it would bankrupt the province.
Alex Locke
Reply to @Mark Butler:
Meaningless in terms of whether vaccines are safe or not. The vaccine
injury compensation program was set up to fend off spurious lawsuits
against vaccine makers that only had to pass a low bar of convincing a
jury that maybe the vaccine caused some injury. Vaccine makers were
going to back off making much-needed vaccines. The compensation program
itself is a no-fault system, and a payout does not prove there was an
injury caused by a vaccine.
Dusty Green
Reply to @Alex Locke:
Also- that 4.1 billion number is way off, and is touted around as
"proof" that vaccines are dangerous. The number that anti-vaxxers throw
around from the VICP program in the states is the full cost of hiring
lawyers, only a tiny number of cases actually make it through and are
given money, but even within those cases- there is no link between the
vaccination and the patients symptoms. Anti-vaxxers should visit the
VICP website, where it breaks down this process.
David Amos
Reply to @Alex Locke:
Methinks the legal game supported by a questionable court was just a
function of lawyers protecting their well heeled clients N'esy Pas?
Awistoyus Nahasthay I'm
about as anti-Con as you can be, but, for this Bill, even I can see
that NB Cons deserve credit here. This Bill should pass with ALL party
support, and any party (or individual MLA) that votes against it should
be soundly run out of office next election.
Now, if only they would bring this level of evidence based decision
making to the rest of their policies...but perhaps that is too much to
ask.
David Amos
Reply to @Awistoyus Nahasthay: Yea right
Marguerite
Deschamps Car - D; from an NDP to a CONservative! These two are lightyears away in their ideologies.
David Amos
Reply to @Marguerite
Deschamps: Methinks you should not complain because Cardy also supports
you and your SANB cohorts N'esy Pas?
Marguerite
Deschamps
Reply to @David Amos: he is just a big hippo who can't be trusted.!
David Amos
Reply to @Marguerite Deschamps: You should know
Wade
MacGregor The
proposed legislation is too weak. Failing to get your child vaccinated
is culpable neglect that could cause your child's death. Vaccination
should be mandatory for all children; failure to vaccinate should be
considered grounds for removal of the child.
David Amos
Reply to @Wade
MacGregor: Methinks some folks may be having a little Deja Vu about the
sixties scoop after reading your words N'esy Pas?
Alexandre Hilton
Reply to @Wade
MacGregor: As long as we can take children away from people who claim
their 5 year olds are 'trans' and start injecting them with hormone,
I'll agree with you.
John Smith
Reply to @Alexandre Hilton: this is the jurisdiction they are trying to claim here the jurisdiction over ones body
Mac Isaac
Reply to @john smith:
When your "jurisdiction" starts to impact MY "jurisdiction", that's
where we, as a society, have the absolute inalienable right to say:
STOP! This absolutely (again) is comparable to what happens when a
number of children don't get vaccinated and affects the health of others
around him/her. THAT is precisely why society MUST demand ALL children
be vaccinated and re-vaccinated as needed. Canadians are a nation of
laws, but unlike the Americans with their "individual rights" that has
been actually written into their laws and constitution, Canadians (and
most of the rest of the world) has recognized the lunacy of this kind of
thinking: the "whole" is far, far, far more important than the
"individual"! This is Canada; this is New Brunswick...if you're such a
believer in your individual rights may I suggest you go where that
philosophy logically should take you!
John Smith
Reply to @Mac Isaac: if your vaccinated why worry
John Smith
Reply to @Mac Isaac:
the individuals right should be sought to be the highest form of rights
your thought process leads to authoritarian rule whats next forced chips
so teh hospital can track your excercise and big mac intake
David Amos
Reply to @john smith:
Methinks we should all worry about the well being of parents who could
lose their children because of the actions of questionable political
dudes like Cardy N'esy Pas?
Stephen
Kotyck
Reply to @Wade
MacGregor: Getting your child vaccinated is culpable neglect that could
cause your child's death. That's why vaccination is not mandatory for
all children, vaccinating should be considered grounds for removal of
the child.
Darlene Hunter Archibald I’m appalled after listening to much of the testimony today that such a biased view is being reported.
If there is any risk (and there is), there must be a choice.
David Amos
Reply to @Darlene Hunter Archibald: I wholeheartedly agree
Murray Brown Congratulations
to Mr. Cardy... This country needs more politicians who stand up to
groups who specialize in inflaming and resurrecting conspiracy theories
that are detrimental to our society. In Pakistan aid workers have been
murdered and threatened by a populace that has been fed superstitions
about polio vaccinations... Imagine the state of this country and our
healthcare system if people in the 60s and 70s had refused to have their
children vaccinated against polio. Smallpox has been eradicated from
our planet thanks to vaccines and it only took 180 years to do so...
Before that smallpox had killed hundreds of millions of humans
throughout the world for eons. Vaccines work. Period!
David Amos
Reply to @Murray Brown: Methinks we all know that you think Mr Higgs and his cohorts can do no wrong N'esy Pas?
Ellen Roach The
important thing to keep sight of is everyone is trying to do what they
think is best by their children. Peer reviewed research exists on both
sides of this issue. That is not debatable. Anytime anyone calls into
question the decisions parents make on behalf of their children mama
bear comes out roaring. Values and beliefs have deep roots. If both
sides are unable to see a compromise this issue may never be resolved .
The defamation of character/ accusatory manner this government had laid
out is deplorable. On the other side , it is important to have an open
mind. However some people’s minds are so open their brain falls out.
Are you pro choice? Are you a libertarian? Do you support political freedom and autonomy?
I think these are the questions New Brunswickers should be asking themselves
Bob Smith
Reply to @Ellen Roach: There is no peer reviewed research that argues against vaccination...that is wrong.
Awistoyus Nahasthay
Reply to @Ellen Roach:
I challenge you to cite even one article calling into question the safety of vaccines form a respected peer reviewed journal!
I'll help you out...you can't do it.
And, quite frankly, I don't give a damn about anybody's deep rooted
values and beliefs when those values and beliefs put the lives of
innocent children at risk, and to argue that you do have that right is
the height of arrogance and selfishness!
David Amos
Reply to @Awistoyus Nahasthay: "to argue that you do have that right is the height of arrogance and selfishness!"
Methinks you should look in the mirror sometime N'esy Pas?
Awistoyus Nahasthay
Reply to @David Amos:
Perhaps you should crack a dictionary?
John Smith
Reply to @Awistoyus
Nahasthay: but you can find papers suggesting female dogs are mistreated
at dog parks which was a prank to prove your righteousness false it was
made just for you
SarahRose Werner I'm
looking out my window to see if pigs are flying yet. Dominic Cardy and
I actually agree on something, so I figure the flying pigs are due any
minute now.
David Amos
Reply to @SarahRose Werner: Methinks you should take a nap and perhaps the strange pigs will be gone when you awake N'esy Pas?
Errol Willis I
don't agree with much this Liberal government says, especially Cardy,
but he is right on this one. People trust foolishness they read on teh
internet more than trained professionals. The medical equivalent of
Trump's GOP
David Amos
Reply to @Errol Willis: Methinks Cardy is still a Conservative for the time being anyway N'esy Pas?
Joe Campbell I also wonder if anti-vaxers take antibiotics if they get serious infections? Would that make them hypocrite?
Bob Smith
Reply to @Joe
Campbell: If anti-vaxers need an operation, do they not realize the
operating room is sterilized before the procedure? The instruments are
as well...and all for safety/health reasons.
David Amos
Reply to @Joe Campbell: How are the two issues even remotely related?
David Amos
Reply to @Bob Smith: Whats your point?
Greg Miller Simple -- "no tickee no laundry"! No vaccine no schooling. This has been and should be the rule. End of discussion!
Junkman George
Reply to @Greg Miller:
That is the current existing law, with 2 exceptions: medical and
religious. The law has simply not been enforced, by the schools, and the
public health nurse. Probably due to funding cuts and because the
funding is still cut don't expect anything to change.
ALL you are witness to is a smokescreen. Folks appearing to be doing,
but not really doing, and certainly not fixing what is wrong with our
schools.
David Amos
Reply to @Junkman George: YUP
Junkman George
Reply to @David Amos:
Just so "distracted" we can't see (or another "D" word).
Joe
Campbell I
am sure if you talk to most of the anti-vaxers, they probably have been
vaccinated. So they never got sick from the measles or any of the other
diseases the we get shots for. Parents of the kids are all still
alive...wonder why?
David Amos
Reply to @Joe
Campbell: Methinks a lot folks my age and older had the measles and
chickpox etc long before a vaccination for such things was dreamed up by
big pharma N'esy Pas?
Errol Willis
Reply to @David Amos:
Maybe so ....and look - you can't put together a sentence without
"methinks" and the unquenchable need to post on every single comment.
That warrants vaccines for me.
Junkman George
Reply to @David Amos:
You must be older than I, or my mother.
We were both lined up at school (not together, 35 years apart) and
vaccinated, within weeks of starting grade 1, by the public health
nurse. Of course not in NB, so I can't speak to what went on here, or
didn't go on.
David Amos
Reply to @Junkman George: I was vaccinated as well I also went into a coma and also had measles and chickenpox later
Randy McNally
Reply to @David Amos:
I would agree. I was born in the early 50's. The only shots I have
had were the norm for that time including polio, smallpox, diphtheria
and tb. I've had the chicken pox, rubella, red measles and mumps and I'm
sure my immune system is stronger for it.
Brian
Spence Did you know that Canada locked up Pacifists during WW2.
Apparently these Canadians weren't willing to take ( or get ) shots. ( for the team )
David Amos
Reply to @Brian
Spence: Methinks history has a bad habit of repeating itself Cardy and
his cohorts know that I have been locked twice thus far even though the
Feds try to deny it Truth is stranger than fiction N'esy Pas?
Junkman George Reply to @Brian Spence:
That's not what I was told. I was told they were all hiding in the woods of Quebec.
Brian
Spence Who is paying all the pro-vaxers?
Bob Smith
Reply to @Brian
Spence: You mean, people such as doctors? You know, the ones who
practice medicine and aren't chiropractors like Churchill? In Canada,
Medicare covers the doctors. I trust their opinion over a pediatrician
from California any day.
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Bob Smith:
You do realize your argument is cyclical. You have pharmaceutical
lobbyists paying off the government and giving kickbacks to pharmacists
and doctors. You have politicians pushing state paid health care which
pays the doctors who prescribe the vaccines at request of the
government. They are all in cahoots.
Bob Smith
Reply to @Alex Forbes: My argument ends with this...vaccines work.
David Amos
Reply to @Alex Forbes: BINGO
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Bob Smith: Placebos work too...
Alex Forbes Until they remove blood from all mandatory vaccines people can easily challenge this on religious grounds.
David Amos
Reply to @Alex Forbes: What about mercury etc?
Alex Forbes
Reply to @David Amos:
I am just talking about religious objections. Health objections are
another matter and I agree with you also.
John Smith Reply
to @Alex Forbes: what about aborted fetus tissue never mind all teh
sleeper viruses just waiting to species leap through these vaccines sv40
anyone saved ya from polio and swine but hey it gives ya cancer
Brian Spence Let's buy some scientists to tell us to do more of what is good for us and less of what is bad for us.
(hint) Cannabis -good, alc, tabac and harma-drugs - bad.
But I'm sure that you knew that, already, by the way, that they, make you feel.
David Amos
Reply to @Brian Spence: Exactly
Ellen Roach One
of the most unfortunate things of this whole proposed bill is what has
resulted because of it. There is credible peer reviewed research for
both arguments. That is not debatable. Whenever anyone’s choices in
regards to decisions they make on behalf of their children are brought
into question mama bear comes out roaring. Everyone is only
substantiating their values and beliefs. The ridicule parents are
imposing on each other by questioning their decisions as responsible
parents is disheartening.
David Amos
Reply to @Ellen Roach: Well put
Brian Spence
Get your religious vaccinations here.
We don't vaccinate you against all religions, just the wrong ones.
You can't go to school or buy food, if you don't believe.
Get your science vaccinations here.
David Amos
Reply to @Brian Spence: and don't forget to pay your taxes in order to support this nonsense
Lucinda Sanschagrin Your vaccination schedule for next year... fifty shots because the minister says so.
Are you ok with that? Do you need any surgical mesh or biocell implants?
David Amos
Reply to @lucinda sanschagrin: Methinks I can think of 50 ways to dump a turncoat Minister in the next election N'esy Pas?
Junkman George
Reply to @David Amos:
I wouldn't count on it, he's pretty slippery, who knows next incarnation he may be a Liberal.
David Amos
Reply to @Junkman George: Methinks odds are that he will turn Green next time N'esy Pas?
Randy McNally
Reply to @David Amos: I think I seen him turning yesterday - a couple of times
Bob Smith It's
easy for the ani-vaxxers to talk...spread misinformation and conspiracy
talk with no evidence to back up the accusations. After the cameras are
down, they go back to their home province or country and leave everyone
here to make the decisions that don't affect them.
David Amos
Reply to @Bob Smith: Methinks you find it rather easy too N'esy Pas?
Lucinda Sanschagrin They are over vaccinating dogs. I guess it's our turn now.
David Amos Reply
to @lucinda sanschagrin: Methinks many would agree that you and your
hero Cardy are the ones who need a dictionary N'esy Pas?
Dwight Mullover It
is quite amazing how seemingly intelligent people believe the mistruths
of social media rather than believe proven results and scientific based
evidence that vaccines work and save millions of lives. I support the
Minister new law.
David Amos
Reply to @Dwight Mullover: Methinks you may have partaken of too much fluoridated water N'esy Pas?
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Dwight
Mullover: It's quite amazing the number of seemingly intelligent people
who believe everything our government says even though time and time
again they have proven they are only in it for themselves and their
corporate donors.
Roger Richard
Reply to @Dwight Pullover: Are you talking about Health Canada?
Wayne Mac Arthur Ms
Curchill and Mr Sears seem to know little of what goes on in some parts
of the world where they cannot afford to vaccinate the population .
Children die in alarming numbers. How can they ignore that ? Personal
choice cannot be allowed to trump protection of the public.
David Amos
Reply to @Wayne Mac Arthur: Have ever heard of the WHO Flu and Baxter?
Roger Richard
Reply to @David Amos: Please explain. I, for one, got busy with life and did not pay enough attention to what was going on.
David Amos
Reply to @Roger
Richard: Trust that I will call you and expanse but anyone can Google
the WHO Flu circa 2009.Trust that it was quite a world wide
circus.However hen New Brunswick got involved in Baxter's play for the
big score withe WHO Flu Dr. Paul Van Buynder the deputy chief medical
health officer for NB tried to have me arrested while his wife was
promoting the vaccine.
Health, July 29, 2009 - Miramichi
H1N1 pandemic update
Dr. Paul Van Buynder, deputy chief medical officer of health, provided
an update on the H1N1 pandemic on Thursday, July 30, in Miramichi.
From left: Dr. Denis Allard, regional medical officer of health, East
Region; Van Buynder; and Ginette Pellerin, director of Public Health
for Regional Health Authority B - Miramichi zone 7 and Moncton zone 1.
MLAs struggle with how to vote on mandatory vaccination for students bill
Law amendments committee hears from New Brunswick Pharmacists'
Association on final day of hearings
Jacques Poitras · CBC News · Posted: Aug 29, 2019 3:23 PM AT
397 comments
David Amos
Methinks i should remind Mr Cardy and his cohorts about what went down
10 years ago between New Brunswick's vaccination expert Dr. Paul Van
Buynder the deputy chief medical officer of health and I N'esy Pas?
So Dr Van Buynder are you and the politicians still attempting to call
me crazy today? Also do you have apersonal lawyer?
I must ask Minister Mike Murphy how many Death Threats should I
recieve and and how many times should my children be sexually
harrassed before it is proper from me to sue the Crown and you as
well? Call me crazy but I take such things kinda personal.
You and T.J. Burke got your knickers in quite a knot years ago over a
mere weathergirl statement correct? What would you do Mikey if you got
locked up in a hospital that you were master of disater of and
assaulted and injected with drugs based on false allegations while
bloggers where having a hay day violating your privacy. Then wait for
over a year for an old friend to have it investigated. When i make
inquiries as to the the results of an investigation everybody plays
dumb orI am told by such people as Megan Cumby not to call back or I
will be arrested AGAIN?? When I finally get talk to Doctor Banic he
PRETENDS that he does not even remember meeting meinside the hospital
that you oversaw as Minister. One thing I do know about myself is that
I am very hard to forget once you have met even briefly. I am certain
that the infamous blogger Chucky Leblanc and his old buddies the
politcal lawyers Bernie Lord and Bruce Noble would have to agree with
that simple statement.
On the topic of what I call the WHO FLU whats gonna happen if a lot of
folks you serve and protect get sick and jam up the hospital just
because they took Van Buynder's advice and people become aware of this
email before the news broke about the flu shot today EH? Well Mikey
Baby now that you are the Attorney General do ya wanna settle on
behalf of the CROWN or wait until I sue ya personally too?
Scroll down you can never deny that you didn't ask the RCMP to
investigate my concerns long before the stock market took a dive. Now
that all the taxpayers have top up your pension plan losses to the
tune of what was 300 million a year, I must ask the obvious question.
Do you think that you and all the overpaid bureaucrat have even earned
your wages let alone deserve a pension when legions of taxpayers are
losing their jobs and their life savings as well because people such
as yourself refused to act within the scope of your employments since
I first began making the CROWN aware of my concerns in early 2002???
In closing in must say the Dr may wish to call me crazy again because
I don't show resopect to power or position. In my book respect is
earned not demanded and I feel compeeld to remind him of an Oath TO DO
NO HARM if he has no conscience at all. I am not crazy because I
disagree with his decions and offer evidence to support that thinkinf.
It is still supposed to be a democracy CORRECT? As far as that
outspoken French dude on welfare Chucky Leblanc methinks he bites the
hand that feeds way too much to suit mean old me. His constant
bitching in his blog about shady six million daollar deal during the
flood is chump change. If you wish to make abig splash locally look to
the budgets then apply the same problem globally.
This email is about the heath of all people and the world economy. Get
it stupid?
I guess i should forward this email to New Zealand because I thinking
about moving there. I hear they like bike mechanics down there and i
can't get a job to keep me out of the cold up here. It appears nobody
wants me around because the politicans and the cops have put the word
out. Thus before I go I really should keep my word file some some
rather imporatant in Federal Court N'esy pas? Methinks for the benfit
of my conscience and the well being of others I should file something
about the FLU first. However I really think I should file about my
rights under Section 2 of the Charter. everybody and hiis dog knows I
was very illegally banished fot the Legislative properties in 2004
while I was running in the election of the 38th Parliament of Canada
and are to chicken to talk about it because my lawsuit would be a slam
dunk then CORRECT?
•Working to keep the flu out of the pews
•Ontario delays fall flu shots over H1N1 threat
•Kids will require two H1N1 shots
. Article Comments (63) Patrick White
Winnipeg — From Monday's Globe and Mail
Last updated on Monday, Sep. 28, 2009 08:27AM EDT
.A “perplexing” Canadian study linking H1N1 to seasonal flu shots is
throwing national influenza plans into disarray and testing public
faith in the government agencies responsible for protecting the
nation's health.
Distributed for peer review last week, the study confounded
infectious-disease experts in suggesting that people vaccinated
against seasonal flu are twice as likely to catch swine flu.
The paper is under peer review, and lead researchers Danuta Skowronski
of the British Columbia Centre for Disease Control and Gaston De
Serres of Laval University must stay mum until it's published.
Met with intense early skepticism both in Canada and abroad, the paper
has since convinced several provincial health agencies to announce
hasty suspensions of seasonal flu vaccinations, long-held fixtures of
public-health planning.
“It has confused things very badly,” said Dr. Ethan Rubinstein, head
of adult infectious diseases at the University of Manitoba. “And it
has certainly cost us credibility from the public because of
conflicting recommendations. Until last week, there had always been
much encouragement to get the seasonal flu vaccine.”
On Sunday Quebec joined Alberta, Saskatchewan, Ontario and Nova Scotia
in suspending seasonal flu shots for anyone under 65 years of age.
Quebec's Health Ministry announced it would postpone vaccinations
until January, clearing the autumn months for health professionals to
focus on vaccinating against H1N1, which is expected to the more
severe influenza strain this season.
“By the time the H1N1 wave is over, there will be ample time to
vaccinate for seasonal flu,” Dr. Rubinstein said.
B.C. is expected to announce a similar suspension during a press
conference Monday morning.
Other provinces, including Manitoba, are still pondering a response to
the research.
New Brunswick is a lone hold-out, announcing last week it would forge
ahead with seasonal flu shots for all residents in October, as
originally planned.
So far, the study's impact is confined to Canada. Researchers in the
U.S., Britain and Australia have not reported the same phenomenon.
Marie-Paule Kieny, the World Health Organization's director of vaccine
research, said last week the Canadian findings were an international
anomaly and could constitute a “study bias.”
An international panel is currently scrutinizing the research data.
“The review process has been expedited, so we're hoping for a response
within days,” said Roy Wadia, spokesman for the B.C. Centre for
Disease Control.
Dr. Rubinstein, who has read the study, said it appears sound.
“There are a large number of authors, all of them excellent and
credible researchers,” he said. “And the sample size is very large –
12 or 13 million people taken from the central reporting systems in
three provinces. The research is solid.”
The vaccine suspensions do not apply for people over 65. Seniors are
considered more susceptible to severe seasonal flu symptoms. At the
same time, they carry antibodies from a 1957 pandemic that seem to
neutralize the current version of H1N1.
Even if the statistical link is proven, the medical link between
seasonal flu shots and H1N1 remains mysterious. One hypothesis
suggests seasonal flu vaccine preoccupies the cells that would
otherwise produce antibodies against H1N1.
But, according to Dr. Rubinstein, the research shows that people who
received the seasonal shot during the 2007-08 flu season remained
vulnerable to swine flu well into 2009 – an interval that should
provide most immune systems ample restoration time.
“We don't understand the mechanism,” Dr. Rubinstein said. “At the
present time it is quite perplexing.”
I have received today numerous emails from you. My staff have also
received a number of phone calls. They have been instructed not to
respond and not to tolerate any abuse.
I would consider further calls and emails harassment and would need to
involve the police. Please stop.
I am concerned from the tone of your emails that you may not be well
at present. Can I strongly urge you to consult with your physician
for a review as soon as possible.
Dr Paul Van Buynder
Deputy Chief Medical Officer / Médecin-hygiéniste en chef adjoint
New Brunswick Department of Health / Ministère de la Santé Nouveau-Brunswick
Tel: (506) 444-2719
Fax: (506) 453-8702
Cell: (506) 470-1612 paul.vanbuynder@gnb.ca
-----Original Message-----
From: David Amos [mailto:david.raymond.amos@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 2:32 PM
To: drcarley; jane burgermeister; Alexander S Jones;
hazelbitsnaturals; Alex Hunter; Penny Bright; jacques_poitras; chiefape@gmail.com; danddbroadcasting; Van Buynder, Dr. Paul (DH/MS);
Murphy, Michael B. (Hon.) (JUS); Schryer, Hon. Mary (DH/MS); Ross, Ken
(DH/MS); Graham, Shawn; Dan Fitzgerald; oldmaison@yahoo.com; Richard
Harris; Foster, Ken (DH/MS); DH-MS (DH/MS); Richard, Jerry (DH/MS);
Van Buynder, Jan (DH/MS)
Cc: Barry Winters; rebeccaphb@yahoo.com; hubert; splitting_the_sky;
Mohawk Nation News; Ignatieff. M; Jack - M.P. Layton; Duceppe. G; catharine.johannson@greenparty.ca; maureen.murphy@greenparty.ca; michael.bernard@greenparty.ca; Harper.S@parl.gc.ca; andrew; Byron
Prior; DannyWilliams; William J. Wagener
Subject: RE the WHO FLU and another instance in which an evil
Zionist's wish is my command?
Barry Baby
Scroll down Thanks to you this email is most excellent fodder for a
lawsuit and a book or two as well.
Also THANX bigtime for publishing many malicious comments in and about
my Youtube about you, sending me the proof that many others received
the same emails as you have in recent days and then topping it all off
by publishing a portion of my communictions with many people about the
WHO FLU within your malicious blog.
BTW You did it all while I was talking to the Media dude for the
Green Party about your blog. Not that was truly wickedly funny. talk
about information overload.
In return for your malicious nonsense I will post this email in my
blog. You know were to look already N'esy Pas Mr tough talking noname
evil Zionist? Try to deny that you use UK font again will ya? It fun
sometimes to expose your obvious BULLSHIT.
Just Dave
By Location Visit Detail
Visit 9,081
Domain Name shawcable.net ? (Network)
IP Address 70.74.205.# (Shaw Communications)
ISP Shaw Communications
Location Continent : North America
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State/Region : Alberta
City : Edmonton
Lat/Long : 53.55, -113.5 (Map)
Language English (U.K.) en-gb
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For the record (that ain't a Yankee expression) in my humble opinion
if the Green Party of Canada clues in, seizes the moment and climbs up
the right side of this WHO FLU issue ASAP just as the Canadian Action
Party already has done long ago Harper may have the election he seeks
but without the results he longs for. Despite all their huffing and
puffing we all know that Iggy and Layton fear an election greatly.
However if honest Canadians have any luck at all it may turn out to be
Stevey Boy Harper's Waterloo. Hell maybe even a few Greens, some CAP
folks and a few more Independents may get elected to properly take a
seat in the House of Commons and a chance to act ethically for the on
behalf of the public's interests. If after the next can of worms is
kicked over public corruption is discussed in a far more serious
fashion during all the talks from the various soap boxes outside of
the corrupt corporate media's domain a lot of professional politicians
could be greatly embarassed. Do ya think CBC or CTV or Gobal will say
two words about it all? However many bloggers and Youtubes may step up
to the plate. It would be wonderful to turn the worm on all the
political cromies and their corporate buddies. Wouldn't it be neat for
Common Canadians Citizens to debate the Green Party and the Action
Party etc without Harper or Iggy or Layton being allowed to muck
things up with their Bullshit? Hell of a pipe dream EH Mr Duceppe?
Mr Baconfat perhaps while you are trying hard to impeach my character
in your next round od evil posts you should consider publishing some
of Becky's words too. Even though she hates mean old me nearly as much
as you do at least she is on the right side of this issue. Thus you
must hate her too correct? Maybe you should pick a fight with her? I
know for a fact that she loves a good scrap.
Veritas Vncit
David Raymond Amos
P.S. Say Hoka Hey to your pals in the PCO office for me will ya Mr Baconfat?
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: David Raymond Amos <noreply-comment@blogger.com>
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 10:43:57 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Just Dave] New comment on Me and Bush.
To: David.Raymond.Amos@gmail.com
David Raymond Amos has left a new comment on the post "Me and Bush":
BINGO EH MR Baconfat? I bet the diddler Dana Durnford and your buddy
Dirty Dicky Dean ain't even got the first clue what this is about. In
fact neither do you EH pussy?
Just Dave
By Location Visit Detail
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---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: David Amos david.raymond.amos@gmail.com
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 10:25:19 -0300
Subject: FYI THE DOINGS BETWEEN RUMSFELD, OBAMA'S MONEY DUDES AND ME
SCARED THE SHIT OUT OF DR BILL
To: jane burgermeister jmburgermeister@gmail.com
Cc: Campbell Rebecca rebeccaphb@yahoo.com
On 9/25/09, David Amos <david.raymond.amos@gmail.com> wrote:
> From: "Ross, Ken (DH/MS)" <ken.ross@gnb.ca>
> Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 08:43:31 -0300
> Subject: Re: Hey Ken Who is Mental Health's and the Hospital in
> Fredericton's lawyers?
> To: david.raymond.amos@gmail.com
>
> Got your messages Dave. I am in Toronto for meetings and will be back
> in the office Friday. I will ask Barb Whitenect to follow up with you
> in the interim. Yes Herby picked up ypur bike a while back.
> Sent from my BlackBerry Wireless Handheld
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: David Amos <david.raymond.amos@gmail.com>
> To: Ross, Ken (DH/MS); Whitenect, Barbara (DH/MS); Murphy, Michael B.
> (DH/MS)
> Cc: Santerre, Rosaire (DH/MS); Pitre, Marc (DH/MS); Eidt, David
> (OAG/CPG); oldmaison@yahoo.com <oldmaison@yahoo.com>; Cyr, Judy
> (DH/MS); Burke, T.J. (Hon.) (JUS); police@fredericton.ca
> <police@fredericton.ca>; Levesque, Carrie (DH/MS); Elgee, Anne
> (DH/MS); danny.copp@fredericton.ca <danny.copp@fredericton.ca>;
> jacques.boucher@rcmp-grc.gc.ca <jacques.boucher@rcmp-grc.gc.ca>
> Sent: Wed Jul 09 07:03:13 2008
> Subject: Hey Ken Who is Mental Health's and the Hospital in
> Fredericton's lawyers?
>
> KENNETH ROSS, Assistant Deputy Minister
> Addictions and Mental Health Services / Health
> Contact Information
> Phone: (506) 457-4800
> Fax: (506) 453-5243
>
> BARBARA WHITENECT, Director
> Addictions and Mental Health Services / Health
> Contact Information
> Phone: (506) 444-4442
> Fax: (506) 453-8711
> EMail Address: Barbara.Whitenect@gnb.ca
>
>
> Sorry to involve you but lets just say that I am really really pissed
> off for very justifiable reasons.
>
> This should prove to some folks that at least I know how to read.
>
> http://www.ahsc.health.nb.ca/Programs/MentalHealth/rights.shtml
>
> I have no doubt whatsoever that you would more pissed than I am if
> the malicious bullshit that happened to me last weekend had happened
> to you.
>
> I will try to call you in business hours but I suspect in the end I
> will wind up arguing this dude in court in short order. (On a lighter
> note did Herby pick up my bike?)
>
> David Eidt
> Legal Services
> Office of the Attorney General
> Tel: (506) 453-3964
> Fax: (506) 453-3275
> david.eidt@gnb.ca
>
> Best Regards
> Dave
>
>
> These emails and the bullshit from the news last year should to all
> that I am as serious as a heart attack and far from mentally unstabe
> but the cops have proven themselves to be monumental liars many times
>
> Subject:
> Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 12:02:35 -0400
> From: "Murphy, Michael B. \(DH/MS\)" MichaelB.Murphy@gnb.ca
> To: motomaniac_02186@yahoo.com
>
>
> January 30, 2007
>
>
> WITHOUT PREJUDICE
>
> Mr. David Amos
>
>
> Dear Mr. Amos:
>
> This will acknowledge receipt of a copy of your e-mail of December 29,
> 2006 to Corporal Warren McBeath of the RCMP.
>
> Because of the nature of the allegations made in your message, I have
> taken the measure of forwarding a copy to Assistant Commissioner Steve
> Graham of the RCMP "J" Division in Fredericton.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Honourable Michael B. Murphy
> Minister of Health
>
> CM/cb
>
> Warren McBeath warren.mcbeath@rcmp-grc.gc.ca wrote:
>
> Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2006 17:34:53 -0500
> From: "Warren McBeath" warren.mcbeath@rcmp-grc.gc.ca
> To: kilgoursite@ca.inter.net, MichaelB.Murphy@gnb.ca,
> nada.sarkis@gnb.ca, wally.stiles@gnb.ca, dwatch@web.net,
> motomaniac_02186@yahoo.com
> CC: ottawa@chuckstrahl.com, riding@chuckstrahl.com,
> John.Foran@gnb.ca, Oda.B@parl.gc.ca,
> "Bev BUSSON" bev.busson@rcmp-grc.gc.ca,
> "Paul Dube" PAUL.DUBE@rcmp-grc.gc.ca
> Subject: Re: Remember me Kilgour? Landslide Annie McLellan has
> forgotten me but the crooks within the RCMP have n
>
> Dear Mr. Amos,
>
> Thank you for your follow up e-mail to me today. I was on days off over
> the holidays and returned to work this evening. Rest assured I was not
> ignoring or procrastinating to respond to your concerns.
>
> As your attachment sent today refers from Premier Graham, our position
> is clear on your dead calf issue: Our forensic labs do not process
> testing on animals in cases such as yours, they are referred to the
> Atlantic Veterinary College in Charlottetown who can provide these
> services. If you do not choose to utilize their expertise in this
> instance, then that is your decision and nothing more can be done.
>
> As for your other concerns regarding the US Government, false
> imprisonment and Federal Court Dates in the US, etc... it is clear that
> Federal authorities are aware of your concerns both in Canada and the
> US. These issues do not fall into the purvue of Detachment policing in
> Petitcodiac, NB.
>
> It was indeed an interesting and informative conversation we had on
> December 23rd, and I wish you well in all of your future endeavors.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Warren McBeath, Cpl.
> GRC Caledonia RCMP
> Traffic Services NCO
> Ph: (506) 387-2222
> Fax: (506) 387-4622
> E-mail warren.mcbeath@rcmp-grc.gc.ca
>
> charles leblanc oldmaison@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> Where are ya living now???? Since the media seem to ignore ya? I'll
> sit down for a debate with a recorder for the blog...Now? Don't get
> all exicted and send this all over the world.....lol
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: David Amos motomaniac_02186@yahoo.com
> To: brad.woodside@fredericton.ca; whalen@fredericton.ca;
> david.kelly@fredericton.ca; cathy.maclaggan@fredericton.ca;
> stephen.kelly@fredericton.ca; tom.jellinek@fredericton.ca;
> scott.mcconaghy@fredericton.ca; marilyn.kerton@fredericton.ca;
> walter.brown@fredericton.ca; norah.davidson@fredericton.ca;
> mike.obrien@fredericton.ca; bruce.grandy@fredericton.ca;
> dan.keenan@fredericton.ca; jeff.mockler@gnb.ca;
> mrichard@lawsociety-barreau.nb.ca; cynthia.merlini@dfait-maeci.gc.ca;
> jlmockler@mpor.ca; scotta@parl.gc.ca; michael.bray@gnb.ca;
> jack.e.mackay@gnb.ca
> Cc: news@dailygleaner.com; kcarmichael@bloomberg.net;
> oldmaison@yahoo.com; advocacycollective@yahoo.com;
> Easter.W@parl.gc.ca; Comartin.J@parl.gc.ca; cityadmin@fredericton.ca;
> info@gg.ca; bmosher@mosherchedore.ca; rchedore@mosherchedore.ca;
> police@fredericton.ca; chebert@thestar.ca; Stoffer.P@parl.gc.ca;
> Stronach.B@parl.gc.ca; Matthews.B@parl.gc.ca; alltrue@nl.rogers.com;
> Harper.S@parl.gc.ca; Layton.J@parl.gc.ca; Dryden.K@parl.gc.ca;
> Duceppe.G@parl.gc.ca
> Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 10:37:04 PM
> Subject: I promised one of the Fat Fred City cop Randy Reilly that I
> would try to make him famous
>
> http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=davidraymondamos&search=Search
>
> A man is only as good as his word EH? To bad priests, bankers,
> politicians, lawyers and cops can't claim the same N'est Pas
>
> http://actionlyme.org/FBI_WIRETAPE_TAPES.htm
>
> FEDERAL EXPRESS February 7, 2006
>
> Senator Arlen Specter
> United States Senate
> Committee on the Judiciary
> 224 Dirksen Senate Office Building
> Washington, DC 20510
>
> Dear Mr. Specter:
>
> I have been asked to forward the enclosed tapes to you from a man
> named, David Amos, a Canadian citizen, in connection with the matters
> raised in the attached letter. Mr. Amos has represented to me that
> these are illegal FBI wire tap tapes. I believe Mr. Amos has been in
> contact with you about this previously.
>
> Very truly yours,
> Barry A. Bachrach
> Direct telephone: (508) 926-3403
> Direct facsimile: (508) 929-3003
> Email: bbachrach@bowditch.com
>
>
>
> http://davidamos.blogspot.com/.
>
> Paulette Delaney-Smith Paulette.Delaney-Smith@rcmp-grc.gc.ca wrote:
> David,
>
> I received your voice mail, I have been transferred to another unit
> and I am unaware of who is dealing with your complaints at this time.
>
> Paulette Delaney-Smith, Cpl.
> RCMPolice "J" DIvision HQ
>
>
>
> http://gypsy-blog.blogspot.com/2008/03/media-restrains-itself-inexplicably.html
>
> Threat against Burke taken seriously
>
> By STEPHEN LLEWELLYN
> dgleg@nb.aibn.com
> Published Thursday May 24th, 2007
> Appeared on page A1
> An RCMP security detail has been guarding Justice Minister and
> Attorney General T.J. Burke because of threats made against him
> recently.
>
> Burke, the Liberal MLA for Fredericton-Fort Nashwaaksis, wouldn't
> explain the nature of the threats.
>
> "I have had a particular individual or individuals who have made
> specific overtures about causing harm towards me," he told reporters
> Wednesday.
>
> "The RCMP has provided security to me recently by accompanying me to a
> couple of public functions where the individual is known to reside or
> have family members in the area," said Burke. "It is nice to have some
> added protection and that added comfort."
>
> The RCMP provides protection to the premier and MLAs with its VIP security
> unit.
>
> Burke didn't say when the threat was made but it's believed to have
> been in recent weeks.
>
> "When a threat is posed to you and it is a credible threat, you have
> to be cautious about where you go and who you are around," he said.
> "But again, I am more concerned about my family as opposed to my own
> personal safety."
>
> Burke said he doesn't feel any differently and he has not changed his
> pattern of activity.
>
> "It doesn't bother me one bit," he said. "It makes my wife feel awful
> nervous."
>
> Burke served in an elite American military unit before becoming a
> lawyer and going into politics in New Brunswick.
>
> "(I) have taken my own precautions and what I have to do to ensure my
> family's safety," he said. "I am a very cautious person in general due
> to my background and training.
>
> "I am comfortable with defending myself or my family if it ever had to
> happen."
>
> Burke said it is not uncommon for politicians to have security concerns.
>
> "We do live unfortunately in an age and in a society now where threats
> have to be taken pretty seriously," he said.
>
> Since the terrorism attacks in the United States on Sept. 11, 2001,
> security in New Brunswick has been
> beefed up.
>
> Metal detectors were recently installed in the legislature and all
> visitors are screened.
>
> The position of attorney general is often referred to as the
> province's "top cop."
>
> Burke said sometimes people do not differentiate between his role as
> the manager of the justice system and the individual who actually
> prosecutes them.
>
> "With the job sometimes comes threats," he said. "I have had numerous
> threats since Day 1 in office."
>
> Burke said he hopes his First Nations heritage has nothing to do with it.
>
> "I think it is more of an issue where people get fixated on a matter
> and they believe you are personally responsible for assigning them
> their punishment or their sanction," he said.
>
> Is the threat from someone who was recently incarcerated?
>
> "I probably shouldn't answer that," he replied.
>
> Reporters asked when the threat would be over.
>
> "I don't think a threat ever passes once it has been made," said
> Burke. "You have to consider the credibility of the source."
>
> Bruce Fitch, former justice minister in the Conservative government,
> said "every now and again there would be e-mails that were not
> complimentary."
>
> "I did have a meeting with the RCMP who are in charge of the security
> of the MLAs and ministers," said Fitch.
>
> "They look at each and every situation."
>
> Fitch said he never had bodyguards assigned to him although former
> premier Bernard Lord and former health minister Elvy Robichaud did
> have extra security staff assigned on occasion.
>
> He said if any MLA felt threatened, he or she would discuss it with the
> RCMP.
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: David Amos <david.raymond.amos@gmail.com>
> Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:43:58 -0300
> Subject: (: Yo Woodsman Werner and Danny Boy :) Your defence of me is
> greatly appreciated THANX
> To: webo@xplornet.com, danf@danf.net, Wayne.STEEVES@gnb.ca,
> frederic.loiseau@fredericton.ca, tony.whalen@gnb.ca
> Cc: injusticecoalition@hotmail.com, oldmaison@yahoo.com,
> abel.leblanc@gnb.ca, T.J.Burke@gnb.ca, jack.keir@gnb.ca, nbpc@gnb.ca,
> arnold.hadley@gnb.ca, john.foran@gnb.ca, premier@gnb.ca,
> Jeannot.VOLPE@gnb.ca
>
> At first I though you spelled Soviet wrong Werner but then I realized
> it is how Germans' spell it. Now that is funny but it proved you
> sincerity to Danny Boy Fitzgerald as well because he supplied the link
> to it.
>
> http://qslspolitics.blogspot.com/2008/07/feds-institutionalize-determined-nb.html
>
> http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sowjet
>
> http://qslspolitics.blogspot.com/2008/07/off-duty-ns-cops-taunt-taser-digby-man.html
>
> http://govinjustice.blogspot.com/
>
> http://charlesotherpersonality.blogspot.com/2008/07/david-amos-picked-up-by-rcmp.html
>
> http://gypsy-blog.blogspot.com/2008/06/pc-headquarters.html
>
> QSLS Politics
> By Location Visit Detail
> Visit 4,450
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> IP Address 142.167.95.# (Stentor National Integrated Communications
> Network)
> ISP Stentor National Integrated Communications Network
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>
> ROSAIRE SANTERRE, Patient Advocate
> Psychiatric Patient Advocate Services / Health
> Contact Information
> Phone: (506) 789-2984
> Fax: (506) 789-6587
> EMail Address: rosaire.santerre@gnb.ca
>
>
> JUDY CYR, Coordinator
> Psychiatric Patient Advocate Services / Health
> Contact Information
> Phone: (506) 856-2924
> Fax: (506) 869-6101
> EMail Address: Judy.Cyr@gnb.ca
>
> MARC PITRE, Patient Advocate
> Psychiatric Patient Advocate Services / Health
> Contact Information
> Phone: (506) 856-2924
> Fax: (506) 869-6101
> EMail Address: Marc.Pitre@gnb.ca
>
> ANNE ELGEE, Patient Advocate
> Psychiatric Patient Advocate Services / Health
> Contact Information
> Phone: (506) 444-4446
> Fax: (506) 643-2917
> EMail Address: anne.elgee@gnb.ca
>
> CARRIE LEVESQUE, Patient Advocate
> Psychiatric Patient Advocate Services / Health
> Contact Information
> Phone: (506) 856-2924
> Fax: (506) 869-6101
> EMail Address: Carrie.Levesque@gnb.ca
>
>
>
> On 9/25/09, Van Buynder, Dr. Paul (DH/MS) <Paul.VanBuynder@gnb.ca> wrote:
>> Dear Mr Amos,
>>
>> I have received today numerous emails from you. My staff have also
>> received
>> a number of phone calls. They have been instructed not to respond and
>> not
>> to tolerate any abuse.
>>
>> I would consider further calls and emails harassment and would need to
>> involve the police. Please stop.
>>
>> I am concerned from the tone of your emails that you may not be well at
>> present. Can I strongly urge you to consult with your physician for a
>> review as soon as possible.
>>
>> Dr Paul Van Buynder
>> Deputy Chief Medical Officer / Médecin-hygiéniste en chef adjoint
>> New Brunswick Department of Health / Ministère de la Santé
>> Nouveau-Brunswick
>> Tel: (506) 444-2719
>> Fax: (506) 453-8702
>> Cell: (506) 470-1612
>> paul.vanbuynder@gnb.ca
The law amendments committee of the legislature held three days of hearings last week on mandatory vaccinations. (Canadian Press)
In retrospect, it was clear back in June that Education Minister Dominic Cardy's vaccination bill would not have an easy ride.
On
June 11, Cardy brought the bill to the floor for second reading, hoping
for a quick debate and passage before the legislature adjourned for the
summer.
But the Opposition Liberals moved that the bill instead
be sent to the law amendments committee — a longer, more detailed
review with public hearings. The Greens and the People's Alliance
agreed.
They
wanted more time to scrutinize the bill, which would ban unvaccinated
children from attending public school unless they had a medical
exemption. Religious and philosophical exemptions would be eliminated.
With a majority of MLAs wanting public hearings, Cardy agreed — but he also made a plea.
"I
beseech the members of this legislature that when we meet in committee
to discuss this matter," he said, "we hold the safety of our children
upmost in our minds, and not be swayed by cranks on the internet, by
misinformation and by, bluntly, lies that are told to us in pursuit of
agendas that I will not speculate about in this house."
The
hearings took place over three days last week. By the time they ended,
MLAs from all parties were moved by the emotional personal anecdotes of
parents, and unpersuaded by expert testimony. Several members said they
weren't sure they'd vote for the bill.
Here are five takeaways from the hearings.
The well-organized can dominate the debate
Ted
Kuntz, who said his son died from seizures after a vaccination, vowed
the organization he represents, Vaccine Choice Canada, will challenge
the mandatory vaccination legislation in court if it passes. (Jacques Poitras/CBC)
The
hearings were dominated by parents and activists opposed to the
legislation. Many were encouraged to appear by Vaccine Choice Canada.
The group paid the travel costs of two witnesses from the U.S. and one
from Alberta.
"This is a unique opportunity," the group's vice-president Ted Kuntz said last week.
"This
is the first time that the voices of families who have been injured by
vaccines are having an opportunity to speak to government about the
consequences of their policies."
There was no equivalent network of supporters of the legislation to turn out pro-bill witnesses and re-balance the debate.
Dr.
Philippe Chouinard, a Moncton family physician who follows the
vaccination debate on social media and supports the bill, said he wasn't
surprised.
"I was expecting that the anti-vaccine movement
would be present, and I think it showed New Brunswick what we're dealing
with here," he said.
"They come prepared and they're well organized. … Possibly some people were caught off guard by that."
Chouinard said more expert testimony on the medical and financial costs of low vaccination rates might have helped.
But
leading researchers in the field were not invited to appear. Natasha
Crowcroft, an expert on epidemiology, vaccination and immunization at
the University of Toronto, told CBC News she did not have any record of
receiving an invitation.
Glen Savoie said time was set aside for professional organizations. (Radio-Canada)
And even if they had been invited, there would be no budget for them to travel to Fredericton.
Cardy distanced himself from the invitation list.
"That's
a question you'd have to ask the chair of the committee here, because I
wasn't responsible for who was invited," he said last week.
The committee chair, Justice Minister Andrea Anderson-Mason, did not respond to an interview request.
Saint
John East PC MLA Glen Savoie said several slots were set aside for
professional organizations, and when some of them opted not to appear,
those spots were "flooded" with additional witnesses tied to Vaccine
Choice Canada.
"What this became was a forum for anti-vaxxers to get their message out," he said.
If you're going to call your opponents 'cranks,' they better look like cranks
Education Minister Dominic Cardy said the anti-vaccination movement threatens kids' lives. (Jacques Poitras/CBC)
At
the opening of the hearings, Education Minister Dominic Cardy
preemptively attacked opponents of vaccinations, labelling them
well-organized liars and conspiracy theorists. In June, he called them
"cranks."
While some witnesses presented widely discredited
theories in disjointed fashion, others were polished and
reasonable-sounding — not sounding like cranks at all.
Fredericton
father Andy Clark, a lawyer and entrepreneur, brought his healthy,
unvaccinated children with him when he testified. He opened with an
offer to take everyone to Tim Hortons after the kids raided a tray of
muffins set out for MLAs.
Then he invited them to weigh whether he fit Cardy's description.
"Am
I dangerously misinformed? Am I a conspiracy theorist?" he said. "For
the record, I do believe in gravity and I do believe in the moon
landing."
Another parent, Lily Smallwood, gave emotional
testimony about the serious illnesses her children developed after being
vaccinated. Like Clark, she said she was not part of any anti-vaxxer
group.
"I saw repeated references to people being stooges or
shills, or people being brought here by an organization. The only person
who brought me here was my husband, in our minivan."
Both parents ended up appearing more sympathetic than the picture Cardy had painted.
MLAs have a hard time scrutinizing sympathetic witnesses
Progressive
Conservative MLA Bruce Northrup said he understands why people would
want to make their own decisions about their children. (CBC)
Elected
members of the legislature are politicians, so they're sensitive to
public opinion by nature. They prefer to avoid antagonizing ordinary New
Brunswickers.
So when reasonable-sounding witnesses like
Smallwood testified about their belief that their children became ill
because of vaccines, MLAs were unlikely to challenge them on whether
their cases were typical.
Sussex-Fundy-St. Martins PC MLA Bruce
Northrup told Smallwood that her desire to make her own decisions for
her children "kind of explains everything."
People's Alliance
MLA Rick DeSaulniers told her that her testimony "amplified in my mind
some of the issues I've heard this week. … It's going to help me."
Other
MLAs applauded the "courage" or "expertise" of parents telling their
own stories. Liberal MLA Cathy Rogers told reporters that "lived
experience" can become part of the scientific record.
Cardy
told Radio-Canada he was "stunned" by the lack of scrutiny by his fellow
MLAs. He said parents with stories of sick children had been
manipulated by anti-vaccination groups, and elected politicians should
not "forget their responsibility to defend facts and reality."
This debate scrambles the usual party discipline
Liberal Leader Kevin Vickers said he will allow his MLAs to vote freely on the issue. (Hadeel Ibrahim/CBC)
MLAs
from the two main parties, the Progressive Conservatives and Liberals,
rarely break ranks and vote against the party line. But new Liberal
Leader Kevin Vickers says he'll allow his party's MLAs a free vote on
the issue.
Vickers said he's not sure whether the proposed law is the best way to ensure more children are vaccinated.
It's not clear the PC government is united, either.
Midway
through the third and final day of testimony, Anderson-Mason, a member
of the cabinet, wouldn't commit to voting for the bill.
"I can't say that I've reached a conclusion until I've heard all the evidence," she told reporters.
That
prompted Cardy to tell Radio-Canada that in our Westminster model of
cabinet government, "if you can't support a government, you have to
resign." He said Premier Blaine Higgs is committed to the bill.
Anderson-Mason could not be reached for comment Tuesday.
Cardy doesn't take on easy targets
Cardy sought support for the bill on Twitter. (CBC)
Cardy may be picking fights as education minister, but he's hardly choosing easy targets.
He
declared he wanted the Confucius Institute, an education program backed
by the Chinese government and labelled propaganda by critics, out of
New Brunswick schools. He got his way, in part.
Now he's taking
on an even bigger foe than China: the internet, and social media in
particular, which he blames for spreading anti-vaccination conspiracy
theories and untruths.
Getting dozens of requests from people asking how they can join the fight for science, safety, & vaccines. Easy! Write to your MLA & let them know you expect them to vote for Bill 39. Let me know if you can’t find their contacts. Let’s build a movement for a modern New Brunswick!
By the end of the three days, however,
Cardy was left using social media platforms himself to rally support for
his endangered bill. On Twitter, he asked supporters of the bill to
write their MLAs and pressure them to vote for it.
"We need to
see a reaction from the large, moderate majority in our province that
believes in science and in evidence," Cardy said.
Sussex-Fundy-St. Martins Progressive Conservative MLA Bruce Northrup said he is struggling with the contentious issue. (CBC)
New Brunswick MLAs
got a dose of scientific expertise Thursday as they held a final day of
hearings into a proposed vaccination law.
The
province's pharmacists testified in support of the bill and rebutted
the testimony of several anti-vaccination witnesses who appeared earlier
in the hearings.
But several members of the law amendments committee studying the bill said they were still not persuaded to vote for it.
"I
struggle with telling my neighbours, telling my friends what they
should be doing with their children," said Bruce Northrup, the
Progressive Conservative member for Sussex-Fundy-St. Martins.
Emotions get to him
He
said he had been moved by the emotional, anecdotal testimony of several
witnesses who said their children's illnesses were caused by vaccines.
"I've been an MLA for 13 years and this is probably the biggest struggle I've had, personally," he said.
Northrup said he would recommend to the PC caucus that its members be allowed a free vote on the legislation.
Education
Minister Dominic Cardy's bill would eliminate non-medical exemptions
for children whose parents choose to not have them vaccinated. Those
children would not be allowed to attend public schools and would have to
resort to private schools or home schooling.
CBC News New Brunswick
After three days of
hearings, some members of the law amendments committee studying a
proposed vaccination law say they don’t yet know how they’ll vote. 1:36
A large number of anti-vaccination activists and parents appeared
over the three days of hearings to oppose the bill, and their objections
have dominated the sessions.
But the overwhelming weight of studies by public health agencies
"have clearly indicated that vaccines are safe and effective," said
Brett Jackson, secretary-treasurer of the New Brunswick Pharmacists'
Association.
While they are "not without some risk … the benefits of a
vaccination schedule far outweigh the risk profile associated with
them," he told the committee.
Brett Jackson, New Brunswick Pharmacists' Association
secretary-treasurer, told the committee Thursday that the benefits of
vaccination far outweigh the potential risks. (New Brunswick Pharmacists' Association)
Cardy said it's
vital to maintain a 95 per cent vaccination rate among schoolchildren
because that creates a "herd immunity" that prevents the spread of
diseases to a small number of children who can't be vaccinated for
legitimate medical reasons.
Some opponents of the bill have presented unsubstantiated theories about the risks of vaccines.
Jackson
responded to those claims on Thursday morning, saying levels of
aluminum in vaccines — cited by several witnesses — is "a very trace
amount."
He said
pharmacists are aware of the ingredients in medications they prescribe,
and he's seen no evidence that vaccines contain, as some opponents
claim, tissue from human fetuses.
"I'm not aware of that component in vaccines to my knowledge," he said.
'Some science on both sides'
After the pharmacists' appearance, several MLAs told CBC News they remain unsure how they will vote.
Moncton
South Liberal MLA Cathy Rogers said she was unsure how to balance the
scientific expertise against the emotional personal testimony of several
anti-vaccination parents.
"Science
is always evolving and we learn to be informed by science, by ongoing
data, and lived experience does [become part of] scientific data," she
said.
Rogers said
she doesn't question the effectiveness of vaccines, but there is
"growing, current research" supporting the idea that they can be
harmful.
"The research is inconclusive. I would say that," she said. "There is some science on both sides."
There are a lot more people listening than just MLAs and the volume of mail I’m getting is overwhelmingly positive. There are not two sides here. There’s science and there are lies and superstition. Everyone has a choice about which side of that line they’re on.
Committee
chair and Justice Minister Andrea Anderson-Mason, a member of the PC
cabinet that approved the legislation, said she would wait to hear more
testimony before deciding her position.
Rick
DeSaulniers of the People's Alliance, which the PC minority government
relies on for support in passing legislation, also said he was
"struggling" with how to balance what he had heard over the three days.
"I've
heard a lot of statistics but I've also heard a lot of compassionate,
and I believe very honest, testimony of some of the effects that people
have experienced with regards to vaccinations," said the
Fredericton-York MLA.
He
questioned the logic of Cardy's herd immunity argument because there
are incomplete records of vaccination rates in New Brunswick schools.
"There's a lack of data. We don't know exactly where we are at."
Disputes profit motive
During
the hearing, DeSaulniers accused the pharmacists of being motivated by
the potential financial gain of more vaccinations. But Jackson said
they're not allowed to vaccinate children younger than five years old,
so children covered by the law would be getting shots elsewhere.
Memramcook-Tantramar
Green MLA Megan Mitton said she was also not sure if the committee has
enough data on immunization rates to force parents to vaccinate.
Other
MLAs on the committee were more favourable. Moncton Centre Liberal MLA
Rob McKee said his own father suffered from polio because he was born
before a vaccine was developed.
One
out of every 11 kindergarteners in New Brunswick last year provided no
record of having received any measles vaccines, figures obtained by CBC
News show. (Canadian Press)
He also cited several reputable studies he found online contradicting the anti-vaccination activists.
And
Saint John East PC MLA Glen Savoie, who said Wednesday that the
committee process had given anti-vaccination activists too much of an
unfiltered platform, said he will vote for Cardy's legislation.
"I'm in support of the bill," he said. "It's a government bill."
The
committee MLAs will likely meet at a later date to debate what to say
in the report they'll write and forward to the legislature before a
final vote on the bill.
The house as a whole can adopt, amend or defeat the bill, regardless of what the committee recommends.
Ted
Kuntz, whose son died from seizures following vaccination, vowed the
organization he represents, Vaccine Choice Canada, will challenge the
mandatory vaccination legislation in court if it passes. (Jacques Poitras/CBC)
Several
anti-vaccination activists were given a nearly free ride Wednesday at
the New Brunswick Legislature, presenting their views to a committee of
MLAs and leaving almost no time for those elected officials to question
or challenge their claims.
Three
consecutive witnesses each used their full 30-minute time slots to
attack proposed legislation to make vaccinations mandatory for school
children except when they have medical exemptions.
They
presented a range of arguments that have been largely debunked by
medical and public-health experts, but that went mostly unchallenged by
elected MLAs from four political parties.
Saint
John East Progressive Conservative MLA Glen Savoie said the witnesses
were not getting the scrutiny they should be getting at a legislative
hearing.
Little time for questions
"That's
not what I was anticipating or expecting at all," he told reporters. "I
do believe that when their presentations are done, there should be
enough time for members to fully flesh it out."
Ted
Kuntz, the vice-president of Vaccine Choice Canada, used his appearance
to call for "open and honest dialogue," but because his presentation
took up his full half-hour, there was time for only two brief questions
by a Liberal MLA.
Andrew
Mader of Nova Scotia spoke uninterrupted for 30 minutes, linking his
son Ethan's autism to vaccines. He was asked only one question about his
son's diagnosis, though he said he would be available later in the day
to provide more answers.
And
Terra-Lynn Coggan of the group International Advocates Against
Mandates, who warned of an "undercover dictatorship" unless "medical
freedom" is added to the Constitution, faced no questions at all.
She offered to field questions, but the committee chair, Justice Minister Andrea Anderson-Mason, told her her time was up.
Kuntz
told reporters that he did not deliberately run out the clock and was
willing to take questions from elected members on the sidelines.
"I hope that I'll have many opportunities with the MLAs over the three days I'm here to speak with them," he said.
Education Minister Dominic Cardy says anyone who is speaking out against vaccines is misleading the public. (CBC)
Moncton
Centre Liberal MLA Rob McKee didn't criticize the lack of time for
questions. He said it was "a delicate situation" and questioning parents
about their children's illnesses might amount to putting them "on
trial."
Later in
the day, MLAs did get time to question some other witnesses though they
asked few tough questions about their presentations.
When
Diane Doucet of Bathurst compared the impact of the bill to slavery,
Green MLA Megan Mitton called the comparison "inappropriate."
Platform a 'unique opportunity'
Kuntz's
organization paid for the travel of two U.S. anti-vaccination doctors
and an Alberta constitutional lawyer who appeared at the committee on
Tuesday.
He said
the hearings mark the first time vaccination opponents have had such a
platform to espouse their views openly and in public to an elected
government. He called it "a unique opportunity" to air their views.
Mader called the chance to testify "the most therapeutic experience I've had in eight years."
Those children would not be allowed to attend public schools and would have to resort to private schools or home schooling.
Twelve cases of measles were confirmed in the Saint John health region last spring. (Canadian Press)
Mader
was not alone in linking his child's health problems to vaccines. Kuntz
said that his son died from seizures that first appeared after he was
vaccinated.
He told reporters he did not have any medical or scientific evidence of a link and didn't need one.
"When your child begins to seize after a vaccine shot, I don't need the doctor to tell me what happened to my son," he said.
Cardy
tweeted Wednesday morning that there were "sad and awful stories" being
told by parents at the hearing, but "they have nothing to do with the
bill. They are not based on science. The manipulation of parents by
groups like Vaccine Choice Canada is sickening."
It's feeling a bit premature to bring in a bill like this in response to a problem that hasn't been clearly defined.
- Megan Mitton, Green Party MLA
Kuntz also told the committee that Vaccine Choice Canada would challenge the new law in court if it passes.
"How far would we go?" he said. "We would go to the Supreme Court of Canada."
But he would not tell reporters on what grounds he would mount a legal challenge.
"I think I'll leave it up to the lawyer to make those recommendations," he said.
Cardy
said Tuesday that while he generally would not want to infringe on the
freedoms of parents to choose, the risk to the broader school population
makes it justifiable.
He
acknowledged that it's not clear his bill, which would create the
toughest vaccination requirements in Canada, would withstand a
constitutional challenge.
Child and youth advocate weighs in
New
Brunswick's child and youth advocate Norm Bossé told the committee
Wednesday afternoon that he "generally encouraged" the bill's approach
but said he had "some reservation" about it limiting children's access
to schools.
He said
that might be allowed under section one of the Charter of Rights and
Freedoms, which allows "reasonable limits" on rights if the limits can
be justified.
The
Progressive Conservative government lacks a majority in the legislature
so it will need the support of at least one other party to pass the
legislation.
At least two MLAs signalled Wednesday that they may vote against it.
Mitton
said with more than 18,000 incomplete vaccination records in six school
districts, it's not clear the legislation is needed.
"We
actually don't have a complete picture of the levels of vaccinations in
our schools, so it's feeling a bit premature to bring in a bill like
this in response to a problem that hasn't been clearly defined."
People's
Alliance MLA Rick Desaulniers also questioned whether to bring in new
measures without a clear picture of where things stand now.
McKee was non-committal on how the Liberals would vote.
"If
science is right and accurate on this … the vaccines are the best way
to eradicate disease," he said.
"We have to look at the best interests
of the children in this case, and if that means putting through a
mandatory vaccine, that might be the way to go."
Education Minister Dominic Cardy said the anti-vaccination movement threatens kids and their lives. (Jacques Poitras/CBC)
New Brunswick's education minister has
delivered a scathing critique of anti-vaccination activists at the start
of three days of public hearings on a tough new law he's proposing.
Dominic
Cardy told a committee of MLAs that opponents of vaccination are
conspiracy theorists who "influence, mislead and deceive" parents into
thinking their children are at risk if they are vaccinated.
"This
is not supported in fact," Cardy said. "If you believe in
evidence-based decision-making, you have to look at the evidence, and
the evidence is incontrovertible."
He
said growing anti-vaccination sentiment, spread by social media, risks
reducing the percentage of vaccinated children below a critical
threshold that allows the population as a whole to resist an outbreak.
"The
anti-vaccination movement threatens kids and it threatens their lives,"
he said. "There are no two sides around the safety of vaccines."
'Two sides'
A leading anti-vaccination activist attending the hearings told reporters Cardy's criticisms were "disappointing."
"There's
two sides to every story and anyone who thinks there's one side has an
underlying motive for thinking so," said Dena Churchill, a former
chiropractor from Halifax who lost her licence to practise because of
her public campaign against vaccinations.
Churchill
alleged that U.S., Canadian and Nova Scotia health agencies were
deliberately covering up incriminating data about vaccines.
But she dodged questions from journalists about why governments would do that.
"I don't know what the motives are," she said. "I'm not a politician. I don't understand the political parties."
She
also made claims that have been debunked by governments and experts
about the presence of glyphosate, aluminum and mercury existing in
vaccines at dangerous levels.
Dena Churchill, at right, an anti-vaccination activist attending the hearings called Cardy’s criticism 'disappointing.' (Jacques Poitras/CBC)
Health
Canada calls vaccination "one of the world's greatest public health
achievements, along with sanitation, antibiotics and clean drinking
water" that has prevented diseases such as measles, mumps and polio for
which there is no treatment or cure.
Cardy's bill would
eliminate non-medical exemptions for children whose parents choose to
not have them vaccinated. Those children would not be allowed to attend
public schools and would have to resort to private schools or home
schooling.
He told the committee he was working on the bill before two outbreaks earlier this year of measles in the Saint John area and whooping cough in the Fredericton area.
But those two outbreaks underscored the need for tougher legislation, Cardy said.
He
said while he generally would not want to infringe on the freedoms of
parents to choose, the risk to the broader school population makes it
necessary.
Experts estimate that 95 per cent of a population
must be immunized to achieve "herd immunity" — a critical mass that
makes it unlikely the disease will be able to spread.
Because vaccines don't work in three per cent of cases, Cardy said, only two per cent can remain unimmunized without risk.
Unfounded beliefs
He
said current statistics show 1.6 per cent of the school population have
exemptions, some for legitimate medical reasons and some for other
reasons. He wasn't able to say whether that number has been creeping up
or how many of the exemptions were medical.
But he said the
spread of unfounded anti-immunization beliefs online could lead to an
increase, and that's why his bill is needed. No other province has as
strict a policy, though some American states do.
Cardy said the importance of the vaccination bill was underscored by outbreaks of whooping cough and measles in two cities. (Canadian Press)
A
series of anti-vaccination activists are scheduled to testify during
the three days of hearings. Cardy said normally, what he calls "fringe"
opinions, such as claims the moon landings were faked, should not get
that kind of a platform.
But the anti-vaccination movement needs a public debunking because of the health risk, he said.
Dr.
Bob Sears, a California pediatrician who opposes mandatory vaccination,
compared what he called the "police powers" in Cardy's bill to the
racist "separate but equal" segregation of white and black children that
existed in the U.S. South before the civil rights era.
He was
taken to task by PC MLA Glen Savoie, who said it was offensive that a
California physician was lecturing New Brunswick politicians on what to
do.
Travel funded by anti-vaccination group
Savoie got
Sears to admit his travel was funded by an anti-vaccination group. The
Saint John East MLA said he still suffers from complications from
chicken pox, German measles and red measles that he caught as a child
because he wasn't vaccinated.
Sears also faced questions about
being put on probation by the Medical Board of California over his
intervention in a child custody case about vaccinations. Sears can
practise medicine, but his files are monitored by another doctor.
New
Brunswick Medical Society president Dr. Serge Melanson told the
committee that vaccines go through rigorous reviews and are generally
safe.
But he said because the numbers were so small, he
couldn't say for sure whether the bill would have prevented this year's
measles outbreak if it had been in effect.
"It's hard to say whether it would have had a significant impact or not. The answer might be no."
Cardy's
bill will require the support of at least one other party in the
legislature to pass because the Progressive Conservative government
lacks a majority.
Cardy took questions from MLAs from all four
parties in the legislature during his two-hour testimony. The
Progressive Conservative government lacks a majority in the legislature,
so at least one other party will have to support his legislation for it
to pass.
Detailed questions
None of the MLAs from
the three opposition parties spoke against his bill, instead asking
questions about the details of how it will work and what alternatives he
looked at.
He said education campaigns have proven not enough
to change vaccination rates in other provinces.
He also said it's not
clear whether his bill would withstand a constitutional challenge
because no such case has reached the Supreme Court of Canada.
Despite
Cardy's aggressive attack on the legitimacy of anti-vaccination
activists, PC Bruce Northrup, the MLA for Sussex-Fundy-St. Martins, said
the committee would need to look at "both sides of the story."
"Sometimes there is the in-between," Northrup said. "We have to get to the facts as a committee."
Cardy would not say during a scrum with reporters whether all of his 21 fellow PC MLAs support his legislation.
Jacques
Poitras has been CBC's provincial affairs reporter in New Brunswick
since 2000. Raised in Moncton, he also produces the CBC political
podcast Spin Reduxit.
Progressive
Conservative MLA Bruce Northrup said he understands why people would
want to make their own decisions about their children. (CBC)
Liberal Leader Kevin Vickers said he will allow his MLAs to vote freely on the issue. (Hadeel Ibrahim/CBC)
Cardy sought support for the bill on Twitter. (CBC)
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