David Raymond Amos @DavidRayAmos
Replying to @DavidRayAmos @Kathryn98967631 and 47 others
Methinks the next time the CBSA asks a Canadian lawyer to see their files they should give them Hard Copy of my file and tell them I said Hey Its also very easy to save on smart phones and laptops N'esy Pas?
https://davidraymondamos3.blogspot.com/2019/05/canada-border-services-seizes-lawyers.html
https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/cbsa-boarder-security-search-phone-travellers-openmedia-1.5119017
Canada Border Services seizes lawyer's phone, laptop for not sharing passwords
3825 Comments
Commenting is now closed for this story.
David R. Amos
Methinks the next time a border guard in Canada or the USA asks a Canadian or Yankee lawyer to see their files they should give them Hard Copy of my file and tell them I said Hey Its also very easy to save on smart phones and laptops as a pdf file N'esy Pas?
https://www.scribd.com/document/2619437/CROSS-BORDER
David R. Amos
Content disabled
Methinks the next time the CBSA asks any Canadian lawyer to see their files they should give them Hard Copy of my file and tell them I said Hey Its also very easy to save on smart phones and laptops N'esy Pas?
https://www.scribd.com/document/2619437/CROSS-BORDER
David R. Amos
Methinks the lawyer Elizabeth May and every political animal in the Maritimes would well understand why I am enjoying this "News" to the max N'esy Pas?
Gary McGarry
Reply to @David R. Amos: N’cest pas!
David R. Amos
Reply to @Gary
McGarry: Methinks the Metis and some Anglophones working for the Crown
know that down on the Bay of Fundy our Scottish forefathers and I parle
with our Acadian friends in Chiac N'esy Pas?
Danielle Dalbec
Reply to David R. Amos
n'est-ce pas?
David R. Amos
Content disabled
Reply to @Danielle Dalbec: C'est Vrai
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/fundy-royal-riding-profile-1.3274276
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/fundy-royal-riding-profile-1.3274276
David R. Amos
Reply to @Danielle Dalbec: Methinks you know why my reply was blocked N'esy Pas?
John MacNeil
Wonder which of these accounts is the lawyer posting from. Wonder how he feels seeing many don’t support or feel,sorry for him
Steve Bougerolle
It's hard to know where to start addressing the lies quoted above...
"The federal government says that its current policies are both reasonable and necessary to keep Canadian borders secure" - rubbish. How can a file on somebody's device present a border security risk? If it does, we're all doomed, because it's trivially easy to ship any content at all across the border via Internet.
"Officers uncovered a customs-related offence during 38 per cent of those searches: - yeh, right. How about some more details as to exactly WHICH offences? Finding the occasional pirated movie doesn't justify random searches and confiscated devices.
""There were no factors that I'm aware of that would justify the searches."" - well, there were no GOOD factors, at least. Is it paranoid to suspect his history with the Green Party and potential political involvement in central America might have factored in?
Bring on the legal challenge, Mr. Wright. You'll have a lot of support from the public, I'm sure!
John MacNeil
Reply to @Steve Bougerolle: doubt it as this forum sure isn’t supportive of him
David R. Amos
Reply to @Steve
Bougerolle: ""There were no factors that I'm aware of that would justify
the searches."" - well, there were no GOOD factors, at least. Is it
paranoid to suspect his history with the Green Party and potential
political involvement in central America might have factored in? "
Perhaps you should ask Ralph Goodale the latest Minister of Public Safety and his spokesperson Bardsley what they know about the questionable lawyer Mr Wright and why I ran for public office against them all ..
Perhaps you should ask Ralph Goodale the latest Minister of Public Safety and his spokesperson Bardsley what they know about the questionable lawyer Mr Wright and why I ran for public office against them all ..
Richard Sharp
Before computers, phones and the internet, border security folks could not open first class mail and even CSIS had to get the permission of the the post office's chief privacy officer before it could obtain just the two/from information on the covers of mail. It was so quaint but, far as i know, they still do. And there were only a hundred or fewer federal wiretaps a year in the entire country. Telephone privacy was close to 100% secure too.
Electronic mail and devices have all but ended snail mail and Ma Bell is a shadow of its former self. Governments, businesses and more underhanded parties are now feasting on all of the personal information we are giving away for free. And we are less free.
Jay Mann
Reply to @Richard Sharp:
Electronic communications and devices should have the same protections as old fashioned snail mail.
Electronic communications and devices should have the same protections as old fashioned snail mail.
Richard Sharp
Reply to @Jay Mann:
Well, I think border guards could always open brief cases but reading documents in them? Don't think so.
In my view, treating all border crossers as potential smugglers, gun runners, child pornographers and all around criminals is a bad starting point. But it's where we are heading because technology enables controls over we mere humans in mind and in body.
Well, I think border guards could always open brief cases but reading documents in them? Don't think so.
In my view, treating all border crossers as potential smugglers, gun runners, child pornographers and all around criminals is a bad starting point. But it's where we are heading because technology enables controls over we mere humans in mind and in body.
Morgan Stewart
Reply to @Richard Sharp:
Yes that is a nad starting point, but a reality is many of them are now. We have 200,000 in bc at this moment
Yes that is a nad starting point, but a reality is many of them are now. We have 200,000 in bc at this moment
BobbyTaylor
Reply to @Jay Mann: -
not when crossing a border. And all birders are the same. Don't like
it, stay home or leave your devices home.
Rae Quin
Reply to @Richard Sharp: Sure they could. First class means nothing. It’s letter mail under 10 grams.
Rae Quin
Reply to @Jay Mann: They do
Richard Sharp
Reply to @Rae Quin:
Untrue, Rae.
Untrue, Rae.
John Elliot
Law enforcement, like government, definitely does not attract the cream of the crop.
Chris Alexander
Reply to @john elliot:
I got to agree with you there. Been there.
Funny how all those down votes are either Law Enforcement or Government workers.
I got to agree with you there. Been there.
Funny how all those down votes are either Law Enforcement or Government workers.
BobbyTaylor
Reply to @john elliot: - neither does law school.
Mick Murcatto
Reply to @john elliot:
You can practice the CBSA exams over the net. Just pick C when in doubt.
You can practice the CBSA exams over the net. Just pick C when in doubt.
Richard Sharp
Reply to @john elliot:
I love door to door and used car salesmen. Cigarette and alcohol makers. Oil and drug company executives. The fashion and "entertainment" (propaganda) industry. The privately owned makers of weapons of mass destruction.
But government? Gotta hate those public servants keeping us safe, providing services we voted for.
I love door to door and used car salesmen. Cigarette and alcohol makers. Oil and drug company executives. The fashion and "entertainment" (propaganda) industry. The privately owned makers of weapons of mass destruction.
But government? Gotta hate those public servants keeping us safe, providing services we voted for.
John MacNeil
Reply to @Chris Alexander: wow you have esp. I guess if you have a record you vote up given your logic
Mick Murcatto
Reply to @Richard Sharp:
Right off the cliff. Don’t conflate votes with free rein and authoritarianism, which is just one slight move towards anarchy.
Right off the cliff. Don’t conflate votes with free rein and authoritarianism, which is just one slight move towards anarchy.
Scott Stone
"... Bardsley said that if travellers have issues or concerns, they can submit a complaint to the CBSA ..."
After they steal my phone? Now I feel better.
John MacNeil
Reply to @Scott Stone: why would u complain before they are not stealing it is called seizing there is a difference
Howie Torrans
Reply to @John MacNeil:
Would you accept being asked by CBSA to write down the names and numbers of your contacts? If not, why not?
Would you accept being asked by CBSA to write down the names and numbers of your contacts? If not, why not?
John MacNeil
Reply to @Howie
Torrans: I take a burner phone with a spare SIM card . They can look
all day . Hope,they have fun as well. No need to write they can
see,them. Moot point
Lorne Chabot
Reply to @Scott Stone: If they stole your phone then you can call the police. I wonder why this informed lawyer didn't ??
John MacNeil
Reply to @Lorne Chabot: cuz the didn’t steal it they seized it.
Howie
Torrans
Reply to @John MacNeil:
That wasn't a response to the question. The question was, if you were asked by CBSA to write down the names and numbers of your contacts, would you accept that?
That wasn't a response to the question. The question was, if you were asked by CBSA to write down the names and numbers of your contacts, would you accept that?
John MacNeil
Reply to @Howie Torrans: as I said I would not need to write it down they can see them on my phone . It is a response . Simple
Lorne Chabot
Reply to @John MacNeil: exactly !
John MacNeil
Reply to @Lorne Chabot: sadly Grade 8 failed howie as he can’t read or comprehend. Another victim of our educational system.
Howie
Torran
Reply to @Lorne Chabot:
Again, not responsive to the question. If you were asked to write down the names and numbers of your contacts, would you do that?
Again, not responsive to the question. If you were asked to write down the names and numbers of your contacts, would you do that?
Howie
Torran
Reply to @John MacNeil:
I merely asked a question. It's not my fault you can't, or won't, answer it.
I merely asked a question. It's not my fault you can't, or won't, answer it.
John MacNeil
Reply to @Howie
Torrans: I did answer it . Sadly you can’t understand it. Why would I
need to write down anything if it is on the phone. I would get them to
write it down from the phone if they want it. I WOULD ACCEPT THEM
WRITING DOWN THE CONTACTS from my phone. Now move on sonny. Next
John MacNeil
Reply to @Howie
Torrans: look below for the same answer I gave earlier . Please finish
high school so you can contribute to society.
Howie
Torrans
Reply to @John MacNeil:
Perhaps for slow learners I should be a little clearer. You do not have your phone with you, so you cannot just hand it over. You are asked to write down the names and numbers of your contacts. Do you?
Perhaps for slow learners I should be a little clearer. You do not have your phone with you, so you cannot just hand it over. You are asked to write down the names and numbers of your contacts. Do you?
David R. Amos
Content disabled
Reply to @John
MacNeil: "look below for the same answer I gave earlier . Please finish
high school so you can contribute to society."
Methinks the next time the CBSA asks any Canadian lawyer to see their files they should give them Hard Copy of my file and tell them I said Hey Its also very easy to save on smart phones and laptops N'esy Pas?
https://www.scribd.com/document/2619437/CROSS-BORDER
Methinks the next time the CBSA asks any Canadian lawyer to see their files they should give them Hard Copy of my file and tell them I said Hey Its also very easy to save on smart phones and laptops N'esy Pas?
https://www.scribd.com/document/2619437/CROSS-BORDER
John MacNeil
If you google the lawyer all your questions will be answered
Mick Murcatto
Reply to @John MacNeil:
You could google CBSA and you’d find that it is out of control.
You could google CBSA and you’d find that it is out of control.
David R. Amos
Reply to @John MacNeil: Did you Google this yet?
David Amos Me Myself and I
David Amos Me Myself and I
Don Brock
Reply to @John MacNeil: And? He founded the Green Party in NS, I guess that makes him Public Enemy Number One?
John MacNeil
Reply to @David R. Amos: now what will i find
John MacNeil
Reply to @Mick Murcatto: rather deal with cbsa than a shady lawyer
John MacNeil
Reply to @Don Brock: no he is using this as a platform for his next failed political run . So very sad guess he is not busy
Don Brock
Reply to @John MacNeil: to say you have a way to torture logic would be an understatement.
John MacNeil
Reply to @Don Brock: being a con you should used to it by now
Don Brock
Reply to @John MacNeil: I'm a con? When did that happen? Or a you talking about yourself in a very circuitous manner?
Ricky Tarr
Reply to @John
MacNeil: oh, so cbsa must have googled him, eh? good to know cbsa does
their "national security" job by googling.
Philip Lucas
Reply to @John MacNeil:
Poor comment you should provide details, obviously you have the dark web, I do not.
Poor comment you should provide details, obviously you have the dark web, I do not.
John MacNeil
Reply to @Don Brock: no but sadly you are
John MacNeil
Reply to @Philip Lucas: it is called google. Use it next time
John MacNeil
Reply to @Ricky Tarr: nice to see you are using common sense
Lorne Chabot
Reply to @Don Brock: No but he'll be in the one to ten range of the Public Whiner Number
Lorna M.G. Harris
Reply to @John
MacNeil: Don't see anything about him that would "answer all my
questions." So he once ran for the Green Party. so what!
David R. Amos
Reply to @John MacNeil: "it is called google. Use it next time "
Why did you out of the gate when gave you the tip hours ago?
Why did you out of the gate when gave you the tip hours ago?
John MacNeil
So nice now when you mute them
David R. Amos
Reply to @John MacNeil: Google David Amos Me Myself and I
Why would,he spend 2000 on a new phone and laptop. More hyperbole for sympathy
Kelly McMahon
Reply to @John MacNeil: Do you not have a job? You lived on this post all day.
Kelly McMahon
Reply to @Kelly McMahon: If you are not a paid poster, then meds may be needed.
John MacNeil
Reply to @John MacNeil: sorry 3000 even worse.
John MacNeil
Reply to @Kelly McMahon: you,have posted much more than me. Do you work?
Kelly McMahon
Reply to @John MacNeil: Not today, and still did not post half as much.
John MacNeil
Reply to @Kelly McMahon: sure you did. Please don’t worry about being proven wrong again. Why do u not work
Norm Hull
Reply to @John
MacNeil: No hobbies, family or friends? No pets? Either you're paid to
be here or you're the loneliest person ever
John MacNeil
Reply to @Norm Hull: I have a life unlike you norm. Sadly you need a job
Norm Hull
Reply to @John MacNeil: Lol. That's when you know the arrow's hit the mark. The snipes get personal
John MacNeil
Reply to @Norm Hull:
so I guess I hit the mark as your moments were personal. Sad I proved
you wrong earlier. Relax . You may be better tomorrow.
Norm Hull
Reply to @John MacNeil: Aww. Are your feelings hurt. Poor little Johnny
John MacNeil
Reply to @Norm Hull: your turn norm
John MacNeil
Reply to @Norm Hull: no actually you seem more worried than I do about it.
Norm Hull
Reply to @John
MacNeil: Aww. Poor little Johnny. What a way to spend a Sunday. I
imagine this was your dream as a child- spending your adult years
engaging in anonymous banter with strangers
John MacNeil
Reply to @Norm Hull: I
am see sadly you don’t have anyone who cares. You need to be pitied.
Nice knowing you Norm. All the best.
Norm Hull
Reply to @John MacNeil: Poor little Johnny boy. Nothing else to do on a Sunday
John MacNeil
Reply to @Norm Hull: as I said all the best norm you will get some attention some day. This is why mute is so sweet.
Norm Hull
Reply to @John MacNeil: Muffin!
Daman Danson
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Benjamin Franklin
John MacNeil
Reply to @Daman Danson: he never lived during 9 11
David R. Amos
Reply to @John MacNeil: "he never lived during 9 11"
SO?
SO?
John MacNeil
It is not hard to see why this lawyer needs the publicity. Check him out. Very sad
David R. Amos
Content disabled
Reply to @John MacNeil: Methinks that is an understatement N'esy Pas? Enjoy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f1azdNWbF3A
David R. Amos
Reply to @John MacNeil: Trust that you would have enjoyed my reply
John MacNeil
Reply to @David R. Amos: pardon?
David R. Amos
Reply to @John MacNeil: It was blocked
John MacNeil
Reply to @David R. Amos: figures
David R. Amos
Reply to @John
MacNeil: FYI I agreed with you and provided a link to a YouTube video in
with I debated him on live CTV News in 2005
David R. Amos
Reply to @John MacNeil: Google David Amos Me Myself and I
John Lema
All lawyers crossing borders must be searched.
David R. Amos
Reply to @John Lema: Politicians too
Reul Boivin
I lost all respect for CBSA when they let Trudeau back in the country.
David R. Amos
Reply to @Reul Boivin: Me Too
Bruce Nelson
For some reason a few people come up with this gem, "If you have nothing to hide, why worry about it." Which totally misses the point. In a free and democratic society the onus is never placed on the citizen to prove their innocence. Only in a totalitarian state is such a arrogation demanded.
As Benjamin Franklin once aptly stated 280 years ago: "Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
Stephen David
Reply to @Bruce Nelson:
We live in a dangerous new world, as Artificial Intelligence becomes more advanced the danger will grow. I have no problem with the CBSA and other organizations having greater power to search and seize .....it will keep our enemy off guard.
Jack Smoles
Reply to @Stephen David: Who defines the enemy, and what protection do you have if the enemy is defined as you?
Neil Gregory
Reply to @Stephen David:
YOU may not have a problem with being searched without reason, but many of us do.
Neil Gregory
Reply to @Stephen David:
And, when they decide that YOU are a threat, where will you turn?
And, when they decide that YOU are a threat, where will you turn?
David R. Amos
Content disabled
Reply to @Bruce
Nelson: Methinks you can quote that comment by Benjamin Franklin until
you appear half crazy and most folks won't care what it means N'esy Pas?
David R. Amos
Reply to @Jack Smoles: “We have met the enemy, and they are us.” “Pogo,” by Walt Kelly
David R. Amos
Reply to @Neil Gregory: "And, when they decide that YOU are a threat, where will you turn?"
Trust that the lawyer Nicky Wright (a former Green Party Leader) knows I sued the people attacking me and ran for public office 6 times thus far
Trust that the lawyer Nicky Wright (a former Green Party Leader) knows I sued the people attacking me and ran for public office 6 times thus far
Guy Stone
Reply to @Bruce Nelson: i agree with what you said but... its a lawyer here - something is up
Pierre Dupuis
Reply to @Bruce Nelson:
I pity the Agents.
Can you imagine if one of them had Tony Clement's phone for inspection!
I pity the Agents.
Can you imagine if one of them had Tony Clement's phone for inspection!
David R. Amos
Reply to @Pierre Dupuis: "Can you imagine if one of them had Tony Clement's phone for inspection!"
Methinks everybody knows that Privy Council members are never held accountable Hence the Agents would never dare to go into Tony's phone not only for reasons of National Security but personal job security as well N'esy Pas?
Methinks everybody knows that Privy Council members are never held accountable Hence the Agents would never dare to go into Tony's phone not only for reasons of National Security but personal job security as well N'esy Pas?
David R. Amos
Reply to @Bruce Nelson Trust that you would have enjoyed my reply
Daniel Bunbury
Out of control border services, searching and flexing their muscles just because they can. They should require a court-issued warrant for searching phones and laptops, let a judge decide if there's sufficient reason to suspect a crime.
Don Kwasny
Reply to @Daniel Bunbury: By law, they have the right to do it. Why would you object if you did not have anything to hide? Try that at a US border and they will deny you entry. Plus once denied entry that stays on file. Not a smart move.
Marguerite Deschamps
Reply to @Don Kwasny: don't care to go to the US anyway
Doug James
Reply to @Don Kwasny:
By law the things on a lawyer's phone or laptop are likely confidential
and therefore aren't legally accessible without a court order or
permission of his clients.
Daniel Bunbury
Reply to @Don Kwasny: I have lots of private things I don't want others to see - i.e. hide - that's my right, and it's not illegal.
And I no longer travel to or via the US precisely because of their violent society and intrusive border security.
David R. Amos
Reply to @Daniel Bunbury: Trust that all Nicky Wright has to do to make his troubles go away is email his fellow lawyer Ralph Goodale mentioning my name while sending him an old pdf file of mine which is easily found on the web. Because of past my experiences in this regard I have no doubt whatsoever Border Services will give the lawyer back his fancy toys in a heartbeat. Methinks anyone can use Google to file my file called "Integrity Yea Right" N'esy Pas?
David R. Amos
Reply to @Marguerite Deschamps: "don't care to go to the US anyway"
Methinks you know as well as I why I would love to return to the US of A N'esy Pas?
Methinks you know as well as I why I would love to return to the US of A N'esy Pas?
David R. Amos
Reply to @Doug James:
"By law the things on a lawyer's phone or laptop are likely
confidential and therefore aren't legally accessible without a court
order or permission of his clients."
Methinks we should not be surprised to see you spring to the defence of a another former Green Party candidate N'esy Pas?
Methinks we should not be surprised to see you spring to the defence of a another former Green Party candidate N'esy Pas?
Paul Reed
Not wanting to allow CBSA to look through your devices doesn't necessarily mean you have something to hide. It just means you have items on your device you don’t want to share, especially with a stranger.
I travel for business, and as such I keep a lot of data on my phone, but I also keep some silly videos of my family, as well as personal texts, which are of no one else’s business to see or read.
Steve Bougerolle
Reply to @Paul Reed: It shouldn't even matter why you don't want to let people snoop. There are no good grounds to look in the first place. Any content that you can ship on a phone you can encrypt and send more easily (and probably at least as securely) via Internet. That's what Open Media is on about when they say the search laws are ridiculously out of date.
David R. Amos
Reply to @Steve Bougerolle: I Wholeheartedly Agree Sir
Marguerite Deschamps
This is what happens when police powers are not curtailed. They abuse their powers.
Marguerite Deschamps
They were not
justified in searching this lawyer. They only highhandedly decided To
seize his phone and laptop because they thought they could.
Colin Sullivan
Reply to @Marguerite
Deschamps: He spends 4 months in Guatemala and Columbia. Everyone
knows you can be searched when entering the country....including
electronic devices. CBSA didn't have to seize the items if he would
have given them the passwords. If you don't want CBSA to see something
on your devices.....don't have them on there in the first place when
crossing the border.
Marguerite
Deschamps
Reply to @Colin Sullivan: why can't he bring his files with him to work on when he's abroad?
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Marguerite Deschamps: In nearly 40% of cases they seize phones they find CBSA relevant illegal material.
Rick B. Jordan
Reply to @Alex Forbes:
And how many of these 'cases' have progressed to the point where the information harvested has formed the basis for the successful prosecution of a serious criminal act?
The use of internally generated statistics to legitimize policy decisions is a common practice within the current political environment.
And how many of these 'cases' have progressed to the point where the information harvested has formed the basis for the successful prosecution of a serious criminal act?
The use of internally generated statistics to legitimize policy decisions is a common practice within the current political environment.
Archi
Smith
Reply to @Alex
Forbes: yes, instead of 1 bottle of Cuban rum someone got 2 bottle for
the total cost of $6...very relevant information and probably 100% in
all cases
Richard Donald
Reply to @Archi
Smith: 1) not stored in a phone or laptop. 2) If you lie about the
$3 bottle of rum then you have broken a law and can be denied border
crossing.
Rick Poulter
Reply to @Marguerite
Deschamps: If Wright was a competent lawyer, he would have been aware
that computers and cellphones are subject to search at the border and he
would have been prepared for such an occurrence by removing all
solicitor-client protected information.
Stanley Baird
Reply to @Rick Poulter: I had the same thought - I also would not be advertising my incompetence by going to the media.
David R. Amos
Reply to @Rick Poulter: "If Wright was a competent lawyer"
The first time I challenged Wright's ethics was when he and I ran in the election of the 39th Parliament and he was the founding leader of the Green Party of Nova Scotia 2 years before Elizabeth did a hostile takeover of the aforesaid party. Trust that Nicky's and Lizzy's ethics professors failed bigtime. Methinks Marguerite Deschamps knows anyone can Google the following to view a little proof of what I say is true N'esy Pas?
David Amos Me Myself and I
David R. Amos
Reply to @Marguerite
Deschamps: Methinks many political animals may find it incredibly ironic
that you come to this lawyer's defense within an article written by
Sophia Harris and you probably know why as well N'esy Pas?
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Rick B. Jordan : You sound like a conspiracy theorist.
Rick B. Jordan
Reply to @Alex Forbes: Aren't conspiracy theories the prime driver behind many of these security measures?
David R. Amos
Reply to @Alex Forbes: "You sound like a conspiracy theorist"
That is not illegal but certain conspiracies certainly are. Methinks whereas someone such as I has filed irrefutable proof of a conspiracy in Federal Court and argued with the Crown it is no longer mere a theory but a coverup as well N'esy Pas?
That is not illegal but certain conspiracies certainly are. Methinks whereas someone such as I has filed irrefutable proof of a conspiracy in Federal Court and argued with the Crown it is no longer mere a theory but a coverup as well N'esy Pas?
Marleni Sulbaran
Lawyers have a legal obligation to protect clients' privileged info. Police etc require special warrants before they can search a place where clients' privileged info may be stored. Canadian border patrol should be no exception.
Another gripe - I was once asked, upon return from mexcio, what i did for a living. As a Canadian retuning to Canada I did not think it was relevant and told the border patrol that. In response, I had two agents pull every item out of my bags over the course of an hour. They knew i was clean - just wanted to show their authority. They just wanted to show whos boss. Lots of Napoleon complex amongst Canadian border patrol staff....
David R. Amos
Reply to @Marleni Sulbaran: "Lots of Napoleon complex amongst Canadian border patrol staff"
YUP
Andro Melikishvili
George Orwell's 1984 comes to mind. I though for decades that the book was fiction. Now to my horror I realize that Orwell's prophecy is here.
Jimmy Pett
Reply to @Andro Melikishvili:
Thanks to 'smart' devices, every breath we take can be monitored. Even in our private homes.
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Andro
Melikishvili: If you thought the book was a fiction, you have been
deluding yourself. I hope you aren't on social media.
Richard
Thompson
Reply to @Alex Forbes: The book is allegorical fiction. I don't care if y
ou're on social media.
ou're on social media.
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Richard
Thompson: Allegorical social commentary. So based on real ideas and
perceptions. If you are on social media you have already handed your
privacy over is my point and should be obvious to anyone.
David R. Amos
Reply to @Richard Thompson: So was the Wizard of Oz and the Animal Farm Whats your point?
David R. Amos
Reply to @Andro Melikishvili: "Now to my horror I realize that Orwell's prophecy is here."
Surprise Surprise Surprise
Surprise Surprise Surprise
Robert Jones
Reply to @Andro Melikishvili: "George Orwell's 1984 comes to mind. I though for decades that the book was fiction. Now to my horror I realize that Orwell's prophecy is here. "
I'm shocked by the number of people here who think it's just fine for the CBSA to do whatever they want. "What have to got to hide? just shut up and answer the question". Wow...really.
The only authority the CBSA (or police, for that matter) has over us is what we as citizens choose to give them, and NOTHING MORE. We decide where the limits are, and how much freedom and/or privacy we are willing to concede for the sake of safety, not them. They work for us, not the other way around...and if they step over the line, they need to be swiftly reminded of that fact.
Jean Pilot
going through your phone it is like going through your filing cabinet without a warrant
totally unacceptable
Big brother
This is abuse
Pierre Daoust
Reply to @Jean Pilot: No Jean it’s call security unless someone has something to hide. Big brother
Roy Nicholl
Reply to @Pierre Daoust:
Absolutely not.
Some of us, from time-to-time, have possession of private, even classified, information belonging to business clients or, even, software to access client networks and infrastructure.
I have had border folks request access to data beyond simply booting the device and showing it to them ... including access to information not on the device itself, but that can be accessed from the device. That is akin to the border agent asking for keys to your office and asking you to sit tight while they go search it (without a warrant).
The laws need to be updated so both citizens and boarder security officers know precisely what their rights and obligations are.
Absolutely not.
Some of us, from time-to-time, have possession of private, even classified, information belonging to business clients or, even, software to access client networks and infrastructure.
I have had border folks request access to data beyond simply booting the device and showing it to them ... including access to information not on the device itself, but that can be accessed from the device. That is akin to the border agent asking for keys to your office and asking you to sit tight while they go search it (without a warrant).
The laws need to be updated so both citizens and boarder security officers know precisely what their rights and obligations are.
Phil Mein
Reply
to @Pierre Daoust: Maybe then the government should just install a
camera in every room in your home so they can make sure you're safe all
the time .
Alex Forbes
Reply to @Phil Mein: Bedrooms and borders. Big difference
David R. Amos
Content disabled
Reply to @Alex Forbes: "Bedrooms and borders. Big difference " YUP Methinks the creepy borders guards can make you bend over explore places you wish they would not N'esy Pas? However if you did such things marital bedroom in your marital bedroom without your partner's permission you could be charged with sexual assault Correct?
David R. Amos
Reply to @Phil Mein: "Maybe then the government should just install a camera in every room in your home "
Methinks you should check out your smart phone N'esy Pas?
Methinks you should check out your smart phone N'esy Pas?
David R. Amos
Reply to @Alex Forbes: Trust that you would have enjoyed my reply
Robert Jones
Reply to @Alex Forbes: "Bedrooms and borders. Big difference "
Nope. You can commit a crime in either location. Hey, you've got NOTHING TO HIDE, right?
Nope. You can commit a crime in either location. Hey, you've got NOTHING TO HIDE, right?
Rubin Naidu
I hope somebody starts a constitutional challenge on this.
David R. Amos
Reply to @Rubin Naidu: Me Too
Rudy Baker
Although I wouldn’t like the idea of having a complete stranger rifle through my phone, I would provide the passwords as asked for, just to avoid having the device confiscated. However, I have nothing to hide, and CBSA would find nothing incriminating. It would just be a great big waste of time for everyone involved.
I’m waiting for the day when the officers sit you in a chair with a device strapped over your head that can read your thoughts. They might be a little perturbed to find out what I really think of them.
Jack Smoles
Reply to @Rudy Baker: Apple is releasing the mind reading app next week. Siri will truly be all knowing.
Steven Gilbert
Reply to @Rudy Baker: I would like to sit on a chair and have Justin hear what I think of him!! Lol
David R. Amos
Reply to @Steven Gilbert : "I would like to sit on a chair and have Justin hear what I think of him!! Lol "
Methinks he should clue in byway of the polls and the reception he has been getting from the public lately but I doubt he even cares N'esy Pas?
David R. Amos
Reply to @Jack Smoles: Methinks Siri and her corporate masters do not have to be mind readers to figure out why I do not invest in Apple or their products N'esy Pas?
Louis Pelt
Canadians like to criticize authoritarian countries, but there's more overlap than most people realize. What we're allowed to say or do is becoming increasingly restricted.
James Rockford - ( Spaceman )
Reply to @Louis Pelt:
Really ? Give us examples.
Really ? Give us examples.
Ian William Kiligan
Reply to @Louis Pelt: boiled frog syndrome is strong with the hopelessly enchanted.
David R. Amos
Reply to @James Rockford - ( Spaceman ): Really ? Give us examples.
Methinks Bill C-16 passed in 2017, this was dilly about why we are now allowed to say N'esy Pas?
https://www.cbc.ca/cbcdocspov/features/canadas-gender-identity-rights-bill-c-16-explained
Methinks Bill C-16 passed in 2017, this was dilly about why we are now allowed to say N'esy Pas?
https://www.cbc.ca/cbcdocspov/features/canadas-gender-identity-rights-bill-c-16-explained
Canada Border Services seizes lawyer's phone, laptop for not sharing passwords
Concern is mounting over Canadian border officers' powers to search smartphones
As more people travel with smartphones
loaded with personal data, concern is mounting over Canadian border
officers' powers to search those phones — without a warrant.
"The policy's outrageous," said Toronto business lawyer, Nick Wright. "I think that it's a breach of our constitutional rights."
His thoughts follow a personal experience. After landing at Toronto's Pearson Airport on April 10, he said the Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA) flagged him for an additional inspection — for no stated reason.
Wright had just returned from a four-month trip to Guatemala and Colombia where he studied Spanish and worked remotely. He took no issue when a border services officer searched his bags, but drew the line when the officer demanded his passwords to also search his phone and laptop.
Wright refused, telling the officer both devices contained confidential information protected by solicitor-client privilege.
He said the officer then confiscated his phone and laptop, and told him the items would be sent to a government lab which would try to crack his passwords and search his files.
Nick Wright poses with his Spanish instructor, Nicks Rocche Chavajay, in San Pedro La Laguna, Guatemala. (submitted by Nick Wright)
"In
my view, seizing devices when someone exercises their constitutional
right is an affront to civil liberty," said Wright who's still waiting
for the return of his phone and laptop. Meanwhile, he said he has spent
about $3,000 to replace them.
According to the CBSA, it has the right to search electronic devices at the border for evidence of customs-related offences — without a warrant — just as it does with luggage.
If travellers refuse to provide their passwords, officers can seize their devices.
The CBSA said that between November 2017 and March 2019, 19,515 travellers had their digital devices examined, which represents 0.015 per cent of all cross-border travellers during that period.
Officers uncovered a customs-related offence during 38 per cent of those searches, said the agency.
According
to the Canada Border Services Agency, its officers have the right to
search any goods crossing the border without a warrant -- including
electronic devices. (Mark Blinch/Reuters)
While
the laws governing CBSA searches have existed for decades, applying
them to digital devices has sparked concern in an era where many
travellers carry smartphones full of personal and sometimes very
sensitive data.
A growing number of lawyers across Canada argue that warrantless digital device searches at the border are unconstitutional, and the practice should be stopped or at least limited.
"The policy of the CBSA of searching devices isn't something that is justifiable in a free and democratic society," said Wright who ran as a Green Party candidate in the 2015 federal election.
"It's appalling, it's shocking, and I hope that government, government agencies and the courts, and individual citizens will inform themselves and take action."
Consumer advocacy group, OpenMedia is already taking action. It has launched an online and ad campaign to raise awareness about digital border searches and pressure the federal government to update the rules that govern them.
"These laws are incredibly, incredibly out of date," said OpenMedia privacy campaigner Victoria Henry.
"The way they treat our digital devices are as mere goods and that's the same classification as a bag of T-shirts."
She wants to see separate border rules for digital devices which stipulate reasonable grounds for a search. Henry also said those rules must be clearly laid out to the public.
"We need to have clear and transparent policies and mechanisms for recourse."
An example of an ad that OpenMedia plans to run, starting in June on the Vancouver Skytrain. (submitted by OpenMedia)
The federal government says that its current policies are both reasonable and necessary to keep Canadian borders secure.
CBSA officers are directed to disable any internet connection and only examine content that is already stored on a device, said Scott Bardsley, spokesperson for Public Safety Minister Ralph Goodale, in an email.
He also said that digital searches "should not be routine" and that "officers may only conduct a search if there are multiple indicators that evidence of contraventions may be found on a device."
Wright said, in his case, no rationale was provided why his phone and laptop needed to be examined.
"There were no factors that I'm aware of that would justify the searches."
Public Safety spokesperson Bardsley also said that CBSA officers understand the importance of solicitor-client privilege and are instructed not to examine documents that fall within that scope.
"CBSA officers are trained to conduct all border examinations with as much respect for privacy as possible."
Wright said that wasn't his experience. Instead, the officer he dealt with neither expressed knowledge of, nor responded to his concerns that his laptop and phone contained solicitor-client privileged documents, he said.
"His response was only to demand the passwords to access both."
Bardsley said that if travellers have issues or concerns, they can submit a complaint to the CBSA. He added that the government is investing $24 million to enhance oversight by creating an independent review body for the agency.
Wright has already submitted his complaint to the CBSA which includes a demand for the immediate return of his phone and laptop, plus compensation for having to temporarily replace them.
If and when he gets them back, his battle may not be over; Wright is now considering legal action.
"I think it's important that we all stand up for our civil liberties and our charter rights," he said.
Watch: What border officers can search on your phone
"The policy's outrageous," said Toronto business lawyer, Nick Wright. "I think that it's a breach of our constitutional rights."
His thoughts follow a personal experience. After landing at Toronto's Pearson Airport on April 10, he said the Canada Border Services Agency (CBSA) flagged him for an additional inspection — for no stated reason.
Wright had just returned from a four-month trip to Guatemala and Colombia where he studied Spanish and worked remotely. He took no issue when a border services officer searched his bags, but drew the line when the officer demanded his passwords to also search his phone and laptop.
Wright refused, telling the officer both devices contained confidential information protected by solicitor-client privilege.
He said the officer then confiscated his phone and laptop, and told him the items would be sent to a government lab which would try to crack his passwords and search his files.
Officers can search your phone
According to the CBSA, it has the right to search electronic devices at the border for evidence of customs-related offences — without a warrant — just as it does with luggage.
If travellers refuse to provide their passwords, officers can seize their devices.
The CBSA said that between November 2017 and March 2019, 19,515 travellers had their digital devices examined, which represents 0.015 per cent of all cross-border travellers during that period.
Officers uncovered a customs-related offence during 38 per cent of those searches, said the agency.
A growing number of lawyers across Canada argue that warrantless digital device searches at the border are unconstitutional, and the practice should be stopped or at least limited.
"The policy of the CBSA of searching devices isn't something that is justifiable in a free and democratic society," said Wright who ran as a Green Party candidate in the 2015 federal election.
"It's appalling, it's shocking, and I hope that government, government agencies and the courts, and individual citizens will inform themselves and take action."
'Out of date' laws
Consumer advocacy group, OpenMedia is already taking action. It has launched an online and ad campaign to raise awareness about digital border searches and pressure the federal government to update the rules that govern them.
"These laws are incredibly, incredibly out of date," said OpenMedia privacy campaigner Victoria Henry.
"The way they treat our digital devices are as mere goods and that's the same classification as a bag of T-shirts."
She wants to see separate border rules for digital devices which stipulate reasonable grounds for a search. Henry also said those rules must be clearly laid out to the public.
"We need to have clear and transparent policies and mechanisms for recourse."
CBSA officers are directed to disable any internet connection and only examine content that is already stored on a device, said Scott Bardsley, spokesperson for Public Safety Minister Ralph Goodale, in an email.
He also said that digital searches "should not be routine" and that "officers may only conduct a search if there are multiple indicators that evidence of contraventions may be found on a device."
Wright said, in his case, no rationale was provided why his phone and laptop needed to be examined.
"There were no factors that I'm aware of that would justify the searches."
'Respect for privacy'
Public Safety spokesperson Bardsley also said that CBSA officers understand the importance of solicitor-client privilege and are instructed not to examine documents that fall within that scope.
"CBSA officers are trained to conduct all border examinations with as much respect for privacy as possible."
Wright said that wasn't his experience. Instead, the officer he dealt with neither expressed knowledge of, nor responded to his concerns that his laptop and phone contained solicitor-client privileged documents, he said.
"His response was only to demand the passwords to access both."
Bardsley said that if travellers have issues or concerns, they can submit a complaint to the CBSA. He added that the government is investing $24 million to enhance oversight by creating an independent review body for the agency.
Wright has already submitted his complaint to the CBSA which includes a demand for the immediate return of his phone and laptop, plus compensation for having to temporarily replace them.
If and when he gets them back, his battle may not be over; Wright is now considering legal action.
"I think it's important that we all stand up for our civil liberties and our charter rights," he said.
Watch: What border officers can search on your phone
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